all posts post new thread

Old Forum HeavyHands

Status
Closed Thread. (Continue Discussion of This Topic by Starting a New Thread.)
Physical Culture

Physical Culture

Level 5 Valued Member
A poster answering a question for me about steady state cardio recommended that I look into heavyhands.  I've been reading about it over the weekend.  I found the book from 1982 on Amazon and ordered it for $.18 plus shipping, so I'll give that a read.

Heavy hands was discussed a lot on the DD forum in the early 2000's as a complement to kettlebell training, and Marty Gallagher speaks highly of it. 

I decided to give it a try.  I took two cinder blocks to form a step, and grabbed two 2.5 pound Olympic plates, and set a timer for 30 minutes.  I did 30 minutes of stepping while swinging the weights to various heights, curl and pressing them in conjunction with the stepping, ski poling, etc.   I was not wearing a heart rate monitor, but at the end my pulse was in the 130's, after the cooldown.  It was in the high 30's F in my gym, and I was covered in sweat.  Felt energetic all day, with no residual soreness.  It was a good workout, but at no point was it hard enough that I wanted to quit.

There may be something to this. Anyone have any experience with heavyhands?
 
I have used heavy hands for years, dating from when they first became popular in the 1980s.

If you really want to get the heart rate up, increase the weights a bit. 2.5 pounds in each hand isn't that taxing.  Try a 5 pound dumbell. Watch out for tendinitis, as the very high reps with the light weights can still cause inflammation.
 
Thanks, Brewster.  I'm looking for some cardio as a substitute for running, to improve my conditioning for girevoy sport.  I was thinking the same thing about the weight.  Everything I could find recommended starting with weights as low, but I think my level of strength supports working a little heavier. Did you find that heavyhands worked well for endurance and for fat loss?
 
Steve,

I have never found anything specific for fat loss other than cutting calories, but that is probably just me. The heavy hands work well for a kind of non-specific endurance. I used them initially as an adjunct for marathon training. They increased my endurance, but slowed me down (I ran with them), as they shortened my stride or changed my gait. I would use them as a break from KB swings and snatches, both of which I think give you more bang for the buck cardio and strength wise.
 
Thanks for the additional information.  I use kettlebells for what amounts to interval training with fairly long intervals, for GS.  My training sessions follow a template that calls for several sets, each of which run several minutes, with a couple of minutes rest between them.  Once or twice a week, I'll hit a 10 minute set.  It's a long time, but it's very short in terms of endurance.  From what I read, to really excel at GS, you need some steady state, endurance cardio.  The Russians run, ski, bike, or row.  The standard recommendation is 3 30 minute endurance sessions a week.  I'm looking for steady state cardio I can do in my garage gym without having to buy equipment, and without running.  I'm not opposed to heavyhands walking, but it was cold so I just used a step in my garage.   It sounds like heavyhands might be the kind of general endurance training I'm looking for.   I'm certainly willing to give it a try for a month and see what happens. I like the fact that I had no aches and pains afterward.
 
Heavy hands, treadmill, increasing incline = a nice way to do hard cardio with very title pounding inside in a hurry. I like 5s -10lb DBS.

cool trick - put one of those really wide basket ball sweat bands cover the bell. Then put your hand under it , kind of slide it down to wrist height, and hold the bell. You can hold the bell pretty loosely without losing it cutting down on the tendinitis threat and hand fatigue.
 
And make sure you pump them and don't just hold them like an old lady. You don't have to full silly, but nice hip to shoulder height will work.
 
I have always thought that the baby got tossed with the bathwater with HH. A brilliant way to train a number of qualities with literally no stress or fear of injury. The carryover to sport performance was actually pretty good...a WTH effect worthy of study. It sadly didn't have the macho look that is needed, but it works. "It works" is, of course, often the least appreciated aspect of training.
 
Thanks, Bill.  I'm using Olympic plates, so I just palm them and hook my two middle fingers through them.  I don't really have to grip them.  I don't have a treadmill, so I'm using cinderblocks for a step. No one's watching, so I can look silly if I have to. At some point, I might take it outside for a walk, but it's cold right now, and I'm still learning.  Don't want to look silly and incompetent at the same time.

Dan, I appreciate your response, and your endorsement goes a long way.  "it works" is what I'm looking for.  I want to get leaner and have better endurance so I can be a better GS competitor in a lower weight class.  That simple. 

Today I did my GS training, then 30 minutes of heavyhands, interspersing a few 1 minute sets of Schwartz' "longstrength" moves- a squat/pullup combo, and a squat/dip combo.  A nice break from the stepping, and kept the heart rate up.
 
Steve, thanks for taking my suggestion! :)

Actually, I probably would not have given HeavyHands much thought if not for Marty's article. You won't regret buying the book - I bought for a whole $1! It is an interesting read. The idea is simple. Schwartz based his idea on cross-country skiing. XC skiers are so fit because they use all 4 limbs. When all the muscles of all 4 limbs need oxygen, the heart has to work harder. This is why walking + pumping the weights = a workout close to running without the knee damage. The key is to pump the weights high. Schwartz explains all this in the book. It's actually pretty "sciency" which is why most people want to sell it - too much for the average brain. But if you like the science behind fitness you will enjoy the book.

I also bought the HeavyHands Walking book. Didn't really add that much to the original book but for $2 it was worth it. He has a challenge workout in there using 15 lbs. weights. It's quite humbling.

If you want to get a "cardio" workout leave your ego at the door and start with light weights and pump them high. Having said that, I have experimented with "intervals" using heavier dumbbells (heavy is relative here - I once tried 20 lbs each hand and nearly died). But I lighter weight will keep you aerobic. You can increase from there as fitness improves, or go longer.

Schwartz had a research partner and the two did some studies measuring VO2max after putting test subjects through a few weeks of HeavyHands workouts. Interesting stuff out there about these types of workouts.

Now you made me want to hop on the treadmill for a HeavyHands walk. Hope these work for you.
 
Mike,

   Thanks for the suggestion.  I keep hearing the word "pump" with regard to the weights.  Now, I'm using a step, which may be messing with my cadence, because I step onto it with one foot then the other, then step off. Maybe I'm uncoordinated, but I find it hard to match the pump of the arms with the pace of stepping.  Maybe if I take it on the road, it will come naturally. 

   Is this pump simply swinging the arms naturally, but with an exaggerated range of motion?  Are there different patterns in the book?  I looked on Youtube for videos of heavyhands walking, but the only thing I found was a sample of a workalong video Dr. Schwartz put out-he's wearing a backwards baseball cap, and his cohost is wearing the quintessential 80's leotard.   I watched some of the moves, but I'm more interested in covering some ground.

Thanks again for the suggestion.  I woke up today to an email telling me that the book had shipped, so I look forward to giving it a read this weekend. When Pavel, Marty Gallagher, and Dan John all think something is worth doing, I'd be smart to take notice.
 
"I also bought the HeavyHands Walking book. Didn’t really add that much to the original book but for $2 it was worth it. He has a challenge workout in there using 15 lbs. weights. It’s quite humbling."

Mike, I looked for the walking book, but it looks like it's not available for less than $30 plus shipping.   Can you give any details on the challenge workout?  Maybe snap a picture of the page and send it to me?

stevehmathews (at) gmail dot com.     Thanks!
 
While looking into this I found this Marty Gallagher post on the subject I found interesting: http://members.tripod.com/~salty_eagle/HH_marty.html
 
So I read the section where I found the "challenge." Schwartz didn't really state it as a challenge, but I interpreted it as such. It is found on p. 137 of the Heavyhands Walking book. Here are his exact words:

"Estimating from our experience, I doubt that one-hundreth of 1 percent of the population could pump and stride with 15 pounds to a 42-inch pump height at 100 strides/minute for five full minutes!"

Perhaps it's just the way my competitive mind works, but this to me has "challenge" written all over it. The pump height refers to how high you need to move the weight to where the bottom of the weight will be 3.5 feet off of the ground. I'm short so this is about chest height for me, roughly. The book says that 120 strides/minute is 3.5 mph if you're on a treadmill. I think I calculated that 100 strides/minute for me was about 3.2 mph on the treadmill. I also like to set the treadmill at a slight incline. Doing this I lasted about 1 minute with 15 pounds in each hand.
 
Steve...can you walk outside?  As for examples I would look for vids of Xcountry skiers. Try to mimic that motion. For myself I have trouble with anything over 5lb DB's. It becomes taxing on the shoulders when pumping as he suggests. You might try some 1 to 3 inch PVC cut to whatever length you want and fill or partially fill w/ sand.  I am extremely hungry all day when doing HH.
 
Sorry this is a bit late, but as someone who's used heavyhands regularly for most of the last thirty years, I thought it worth adding my two-pennyworth here.  I choose a weight in the range 3-10 pounds for any particular outdoor session (I don't do HH indoors much these days). They're all still useful as there are always more moves available with lighter weights, with greater range of motion (on some moves) and faster tempo. In that sense there isn't really a permanent "progression" to heavier weights, though different weights continue to have distinctive benefits. It's good advice not to add too much weight at first when experimenting  for the first time with an unfamiliar load or move, especially for an extended session. Dr S always advised respect for these "little" weights when used in an extended session. My workouts are usually 3-5 mile walks, or sometimes runs with the lighter weights. I try to use a wide variety of moves in various planes and even some of the funny leg "gaits" that Dr S illustrates (good for ski conditioning). I can usually get far enough away from other people for this not draw too much unwanted attention (except from dogs) though now that I'm in my sixties I care somewhat less about how I look (not that anyone really seems bothered anyway).

As far as "swinging" the weights is concerned, my own approach has always been to positively "muscle" each phase of a movement, especially if I'm doing intervals, which are very feasible with many HH moves (e.g. try full-range ski-poling or pumping overhead at a fast pace). Because of this "power" approach I've tended to gravitate to what Dr S called medleys - i.e. continuously switching moves every one or two minutes during a session, both to manage fatigue and to avoid twinges that can result from repeating the same move for too long without a break. From the cardio perspective, I find I can still get close to maximum heart-rate during sprint intervals with light or heavy weights, just by adjusting speed and range of motion. After starting HH my resting heart-rate fell quite rapidly to around 48 and subsequently to around 40-42.

Nowadays I mix HH with a bit of running, both occasional LSD and more regular sprinting; I also do classic bodyweight moves such as pistols, pull-ups, dips, push-ups, etc. (Dr S was also very fond of these). I've noticed that HH and bodyweight exercises seem to support each other in many ways. In particular the open-ended variety of HH moves seems to target support and stabilising musculature that can otherwise get neglected. The dynamic overhead moves are good for core fitness too - I found holding plank positions pretty easy without having done any before, for example. As general conditioning, it transfers to hiking, biking and skiing very well in my experience.

By the way, I agree with the quoted experience on the "challenge" of heavier weights, though I do have some 22-pound dumbbells that I sometimes use for intervals with an indoor step - it's pretty brutal.

 
 
I did Heavy Hands diligently for about a year back in 1996 to 1997.  I enjoyed the feeling I got from doing the walking with weights.  I didn't enjoy the strange looks I got though.  You either get over that feeling of "why are these people watching me?" or you don't get over it and you eventually stop doing Heavy Hands.  I stopped because of some family/personal issues during 1999 and never went back to it.  I'm a bit OCD with writing down workouts.  It got pretty weird, even for me.  I was trying to keep track of total swings per block.  Per mile.  Per 10 miles, etc.  It helped ward off boredom.  I only weighed 150lbs.  But it was a chimp-ish 150lbs.  Did very little strength training during that time.  A bit of bodyweight stuff.  As strange as it might sound to those who have never done Heavy Hands for a stretch of time, I felt like I built up some pretty incredible lasting strength.  Yeah, you're using small dumbbells.  But swing them thousands and thousands of times to the heights that are recommended and you will build some furious endurance. 

Do I wish I was still doing it?  Not in a million years would I do it again.  Different chapter of my life, all that, haha. 

But it was very, very effective.
 
Status
Closed Thread. (Continue Discussion of This Topic by Starting a New Thread.)
Back
Top Bottom