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Muscle gain

DanielHK

Level 4 Valued Member
Bit of a noob question here … assume with increased strength comes increased muscle mass - but has anyone gained the bulk if-not-all of their muscle from KB training exclusively or is the barbell still going to be best in class for that?

I am 6 weeks thru BuiltStrong minimalist and whilst I feel stronger, cannot tell necessarily I gained muscle mass

Separately I have ‘easy muscle’ from Neupert. Any opinions for one over the other to gain muscle much appreciated

Cheers!
 
If you're defining strength as kilos / lbs lifted in a grind, barbell wins. Also for adding slabs of meat (with calorie surplus).

But if you're defining strength as the ability to grapple someone for 10 minutes straight, that's another matter...

KBs might be the better tool in the case.
 
watchnerd said:
If you're defining strength as kilos / lbs lifted in a grind, barbell wins. Also for adding slabs of meat (with calorie surplus).

But if you're defining strength as the ability to grapple someone for 10 minutes straight, that's another matter...

KBs might be the better tool in the case.
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Actually, this is an amazing answer.
It's hard to make it more clear than that.
 
watchnerd said:
If you're defining strength as kilos / lbs lifted in a grind, barbell wins. Also for adding slabs of meat (with calorie surplus).

But if you're defining strength as the ability to grapple someone for 10 minutes straight, that's another matter...

KBs might be the better tool in the case.
Click to expand...
This makes a lot of sense - thanks for that
 
The kettlebell is best used for punching volume and density..

Using these two and adequate food will also help you pile on muscle.

For building absolute strength, that's where the barbell is best used..

It's knowing the best usage of each tool that allows good things to happen
 
In a nutcase, lifting heavy things until tired = grow muscle and get stronger (don't forget to rest and eat).

This can be done in a wide variety of ways:

Exercise order
1. Complex whole body lifts
2. Single bodypart
3. Isolation exercise

Barbell, random example:
1. Jerk
2. Bench press
3. Tate-press

Kettbell:
1. C&P
2. Cross body floor press
3. Tate-press (my fantasy is obviously lacking)

Then... if we are really nitpicking about details it also depends. I.e. Highbar bb squat vs lowbar, quadriceps are limiting factor in both. For quadricep hypertrofphy it probably does not matter which you choose. Core-strength limits my KB Front Squat so that's probably not the best tool for local hypertrophy in the thighs.

OH press barbell vs kettlebell... (I have not checked the data on this one) Shoulder limits the weight, probably does not matter which took you lift overhead.

But... Unless your main goal is bigger biceps ignore the above. Lifting heavy (for you, not for someone else) things until tired gets you very far.
 
DanielHK said:
Bit of a noob question here … assume with increased strength comes increased muscle mass - but has anyone gained the bulk if-not-all of their muscle from KB training exclusively or is the barbell still going to be best in class for that?

I am 6 weeks thru BuiltStrong minimalist and whilst I feel stronger, cannot tell necessarily I gained muscle mass

Separately I have ‘easy muscle’ from Neupert. Any opinions for one over the other to gain muscle much appreciated

Cheers!
Click to expand...
Have you tried taking a before and after photo?? Sometimes the scale doesn't budge much but you look different..
 
DanielHK said:
Bit of a noob question here … assume with increased strength comes increased muscle mass - but has anyone gained the bulk if-not-all of their muscle from KB training exclusively or is the barbell still going to be best in class for that?

I am 6 weeks thru BuiltStrong minimalist and whilst I feel stronger, cannot tell necessarily I gained muscle mass

Separately I have ‘easy muscle’ from Neupert. Any opinions for one over the other to gain muscle much appreciated

Cheers!
Click to expand...
If your nutrition is on track and you're getting enough protein (1 gram per pound of lean or goal bodyweight), then you should DEFINITELY be putting on muscle using BuiltStrong.

I've put on muscle while eating for FAT LOSS and losing several pounds!

This is the first time I've ever had a fast and noticeable increase in my arm size (biceps) ever!

Your exercise choices are key. I'm only using kettlebells (other than dumbell floor presses) and bodyweight (weighted pull-ups, dips, chin-ups) for a total of 9 different exercises (because I like and need the variety).

(NOTE: I stopped using the barbell in 2013 other than occasionally Deadlifts.)

I know the program says to rest 1-3 minutes, but I performed it as a Circuit EMOM and only took an extra 30-60 seconds rest when needed.

Remember that another key to building muscle is doing a lot of work in a short period of time (density). Compressed rest periods are key. Rest longer if you need to.

In addition, make sure you're using the Regular or Tough schedule to get enough volume.

I started with the Tough schedule for the first 4 weeks, but it was a little too much combined with 2 days/week of Murph training.

So for weeks 5-8, I kept the Tough schedule for the Heavy lifts and used the Regular schedule for the Medium and Light exercises. That was just right with all the pull-ups and pushups I was doing with my Murph sessions.

I love Geoff's programs (and have almost every single one), but BuiltStrong Minimalist has become my best and most favorite program ever!

I'm making some changes for my next 8 weeks (Deadlifts instead of heavy Squats - my knees can't handle 3 days/week of squatting; Renegade Rows; and Kettlebell Presses for all three Press variations).

I will run the Tough schedule for all my Heavy exercises again, but I'll use the Minimal or Regular schedule for my Medium and Light exercises.

I'm used to more volume for Heavy lifts (25-30ish NL) than BuiltStrong Minimalist uses, which is why I prefer the Tough schedule (it's only 1-2 more reps than the Regular schedule). This helps me slowly increase strength.
 
DanielHK said:
Bit of a noob question here … assume with increased strength comes increased muscle mass - but has anyone gained the bulk if-not-all of their muscle from KB training exclusively or is the barbell still going to be best in class for that?

I am 6 weeks thru BuiltStrong minimalist and whilst I feel stronger, cannot tell necessarily I gained muscle mass

Separately I have ‘easy muscle’ from Neupert. Any opinions for one over the other to gain muscle much appreciated

Cheers!
Click to expand...
Strength gains in 6 weeks will outpace visible muscle mass gains, especially on a strength focused program.
 
DanielHK said:
Bit of a noob question here … assume with increased strength comes increased muscle mass - but has anyone gained the bulk if-not-all of their muscle from KB training exclusively or is the barbell still going to be best in class for that?

I am 6 weeks thru BuiltStrong minimalist and whilst I feel stronger, cannot tell necessarily I gained muscle mass

Separately I have ‘easy muscle’ from Neupert. Any opinions for one over the other to gain muscle much appreciated

Cheers!
Click to expand...
Which exercises have you selected?
 
renegadenate said:
If your nutrition is on track and you're getting enough protein (1 gram per pound of lean or goal bodyweight), then you should DEFINITELY be putting on muscle using BuiltStrong.

I've put on muscle while eating for FAT LOSS and losing several pounds!

This is the first time I've ever had a fast and noticeable increase in my arm size (biceps) ever!

Your exercise choices are key. I'm only using kettlebells (other than dumbell floor presses) and bodyweight (weighted pull-ups, dips, chin-ups) for a total of 9 different exercises (because I like and need the variety).

(NOTE: I stopped using the barbell in 2013 other than occasionally Deadlifts.)

I know the program says to rest 1-3 minutes, but I performed it as a Circuit EMOM and only took an extra 30-60 seconds rest when needed.

Remember that another key to building muscle is doing a lot of work in a short period of time (density). Compressed rest periods are key. Rest longer if you need to.

In addition, make sure you're using the Regular or Tough schedule to get enough volume.

I started with the Tough schedule for the first 4 weeks, but it was a little too much combined with 2 days/week of Murph training.

So for weeks 5-8, I kept the Tough schedule for the Heavy lifts and used the Regular schedule for the Medium and Light exercises. That was just right with all the pull-ups and pushups I was doing with my Murph sessions.

I love Geoff's programs (and have almost every single one), but BuiltStrong Minimalist has become my best and most favorite program ever!

I'm making some changes for my next 8 weeks (Deadlifts instead of heavy Squats - my knees can't handle 3 days/week of squatting; Renegade Rows; and Kettlebell Presses for all three Press variations).

I will run the Tough schedule for all my Heavy exercises again, but I'll use the Minimal or Regular schedule for my Medium and Light exercises.

I'm used to more volume for Heavy lifts (25-30ish NL) than BuiltStrong Minimalist uses, which is why I prefer the Tough schedule (it's only 1-2 more reps than the Regular schedule). This helps me slowly increase strength.
Click to expand...
Cheers. I am doing the ‘tough’ setting. To be fair it does seem like quite a lot of volume esp weeks 5-7

Have mixed in some BB with KB - prefer working with the bells (more fun, better mind/muscle connection I think) but given I feel like I could do with more muscle on my frame 5’ 10” 162 I just want to make sure that I am not cutting corners on a ‘minimalist’ program for muscle growth
 
DanielHK said:
A KB press / dbl kb squat / renegade row
B Bulgarian SS / renegade row / BB bench
C BB DL / KB press / dbl kb squat
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For muscle gain, you may want a few other exercises as Renegade Rows (as great as they are) are not the best for back/biceps growth.

I would use them for one session, but (if you can) perform Chin-ups and 1-Arm Rows for the other two.

Also, dips (if you can do them) or DB Bench Presses may be better than two Kettlebell Press days.

Your DBKFS, Deadlift, and Bulgarian Split Squats are all good.

As for the Barbell, I would strictly use that for the Heavy lifts. Use other implements for the Medium and Light exercises.
 
DanielHK said:
Cheers. I am doing the ‘tough’ setting. To be fair it does seem like quite a lot of volume esp weeks 5-7

Have mixed in some BB with KB - prefer working with the bells (more fun, better mind/muscle connection I think) but given I feel like I could do with more muscle on my frame 5’ 10” 162 I just want to make sure that I am not cutting corners on a ‘minimalist’ program for muscle growth
Click to expand...
Yes, the volume gets quite high so you have to definitely choose your Medium and Light exercises wisely.

Nope, you're not cutting corners with this program. I've been training consistently for 30 years, and this program provided more than I expected despite training in a similar way (total-body sessions) for nearly 15 years.

Next phase, switch some of your exercises around and make sure your protein and nutrition is spot on.

Also, what are you doing on your other days? I definitely would recommend Simple and Sinister or some light cardio to aid in fat loss and conditioning.
 
DanielHK said:
Would consider myself skinny fat 5’ 10” 162 17% bf
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I can tell you this: 17% bodyfat looks different on everyone..

I have a friend who at 18-19% has quite decent ab definition and another friend who even at 13% his abs are not quite visible
 
renegadenate said:
Yes, the volume gets quite high so you have to definitely choose your Medium and Light exercises wisely.

Nope, you're not cutting corners with this program. I've been training consistently for 30 years, and this program provided more than I expected despite training in a similar way (total-body sessions) for nearly 15 years.

Next phase, switch some of your exercises around and make sure your protein and nutrition is spot on.

Also, what are you doing on your other days? I definitely would recommend Simple and Sinister or some light cardio to aid in fat loss and conditioning.
Click to expand...
So it sounds like I stay the course.. tweak the exercises next go

I am currently doing S&S 2x week as well

Thanks for the input here
 
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