North Coast Miller
Level 9 Valued Member
Honestly I doubt it. The issue with TGU, iso isn't at long length for any of the prime movers.
That said, give it a try! Plenty of people told me my isometric plan would never work.
Other/Mixed New training block, Isometrics as primary resistance training
- Thread starter North Coast Miller
- Start date
Other strength modalities (e.g., Clubs), mixed strength modalities (e.g., combined kettlebell and barbell), other goals (flexibility)
Honestly I doubt it. The issue with TGU, iso isn't at long length for any of the prime movers.
That said, give it a try! Plenty of people told me my isometric plan would never work.
3letterslong
Level 6 Valued Member
I bought this Extreme Isometrics webinar few years ago and it's free on youtube now. It's got some really good information in it.
North Coast Miller
Level 9 Valued Member
I'm planning to put together a series that can be done with just a length of strap or canvas. I want to make it more accessible, easier to blend with traditional lifting.
Was looking at some older tape I made when I first started dialing this in - very deficient in hinge and squat but the upper body stuff was reasonably effective.
Was looking at some older tape I made when I first started dialing this in - very deficient in hinge and squat but the upper body stuff was reasonably effective.
3letterslong
Level 6 Valued Member
I'm looking forward to that! I keep telling you, I'll buy anything you put out lol
pgomez
Level 6 Valued Member
Drew Baye has a book with strap-based isometric exercises: Timed Static Contraction Training ebook
I've done some experimenting with using a combination of a tie-down strap and resistance band (loop style) for isometric exercises. It doesn't quite give the same feel as straight tie-down or chain resistance. To my mind, the MVC should be the same; but it feels different, probably due to the active resistance of the band. I'll give it some more tinkering.
North Coast Miller
Level 9 Valued Member
Maybe last prog pic from this "experiment" unless my results turn totally nutty.
Finishing phase one, 12 week hybrid training block isometrics and sandbags. Back up to 200lbs and dropped a % or three bodyfat. Really only 11 weeks as I had a lipoma cut out of my right bicep - a bit deeper than expected, took a week off.
Coming off 2.5 years of only using overcoming isometrics for my resistance work, spoke often planning to add some external load to the iso. This was a long time goal of mine, but multiple chronic joint issues sidelined it for a bit.
Approach pretty simple and largely autoregulating. 2 sets of each exercise, each set structured like a DropSet with the iso standing in for the initial heavy load, the drop set is a moderate load sandbag analog, btween 8 and 20 reps - increase load if consistently over 15 reps on the second set. The isometrics supply high tension, moderate rep provides metabolic stress and blood occlusion in the muscle.
In use, First set (holding endurance and joint and tendon health) preload the muscle about 25%, 10 breaths max effort inhale/exhale isometrics - exert maximally on exhale, attempt to maintain tension on inhale. Immediately transition to sandbag version taken close to failure - leave a rep or two in the tank.
Rest and on to Second set (power/rate of force production), preload the muscle about 25%, 10 hard exhale/Valsalva with *explosive intent*. Exert for about 2-3 seconds ramping to a max effort as quickly as possible, relax, inhale, explode. Immediately transition to sandbag analog taken close to failure. Done. Rest and on to the next exercise.
Intention was to improve body comp, trigger a little "easy" mass gain. Next to determine the minimum dose of iso needed to keep that low-dose corticosteroid floaty feeling in my joints and back.
I also wanted to verify that isos could stand in for heavy loading in a traditional lifting progression a la Drop Sets or inverted pyramid. This worked very well. Honestly don't think I could have done this, at this body comp, using all traditional lifting strategies. My joints could not have handled the volume.
Body comp did improve even with increased calorie input. All exercises have seen a solid jump in load and rep count to the point I'm begining to introduce oscillatory reps with the sandbags. The oscillatory reps are a great tool!
Honestly, a bit more mass than I had at age 52. No pics but my legs def are taking to this approach. My tribal tat keeps gettin smaller, don't think my upper arms have ever been quite this size.
Finishing phase one, 12 week hybrid training block isometrics and sandbags. Back up to 200lbs and dropped a % or three bodyfat. Really only 11 weeks as I had a lipoma cut out of my right bicep - a bit deeper than expected, took a week off.
Coming off 2.5 years of only using overcoming isometrics for my resistance work, spoke often planning to add some external load to the iso. This was a long time goal of mine, but multiple chronic joint issues sidelined it for a bit.
Approach pretty simple and largely autoregulating. 2 sets of each exercise, each set structured like a DropSet with the iso standing in for the initial heavy load, the drop set is a moderate load sandbag analog, btween 8 and 20 reps - increase load if consistently over 15 reps on the second set. The isometrics supply high tension, moderate rep provides metabolic stress and blood occlusion in the muscle.
In use, First set (holding endurance and joint and tendon health) preload the muscle about 25%, 10 breaths max effort inhale/exhale isometrics - exert maximally on exhale, attempt to maintain tension on inhale. Immediately transition to sandbag version taken close to failure - leave a rep or two in the tank.
Rest and on to Second set (power/rate of force production), preload the muscle about 25%, 10 hard exhale/Valsalva with *explosive intent*. Exert for about 2-3 seconds ramping to a max effort as quickly as possible, relax, inhale, explode. Immediately transition to sandbag analog taken close to failure. Done. Rest and on to the next exercise.
Intention was to improve body comp, trigger a little "easy" mass gain. Next to determine the minimum dose of iso needed to keep that low-dose corticosteroid floaty feeling in my joints and back.
I also wanted to verify that isos could stand in for heavy loading in a traditional lifting progression a la Drop Sets or inverted pyramid. This worked very well. Honestly don't think I could have done this, at this body comp, using all traditional lifting strategies. My joints could not have handled the volume.
Body comp did improve even with increased calorie input. All exercises have seen a solid jump in load and rep count to the point I'm begining to introduce oscillatory reps with the sandbags. The oscillatory reps are a great tool!
Honestly, a bit more mass than I had at age 52. No pics but my legs def are taking to this approach. My tribal tat keeps gettin smaller, don't think my upper arms have ever been quite this size.
Last edited:
C. Schwartz
Level 2 Valued Member
I'd really appreciate it (e.g., would buy, don't know if that's what you mean). Partly inspired by this thread I've been doing an iso program with a strap and have been amazed at the results.
C. Schwartz
Level 2 Valued Member
I started using this book six months ago due to having to travel a lot for work, and have been amazed at how effective it is. I'm not really experienced or informed in the way other people in this thread are, but very impressed.
North Coast Miller
Level 9 Valued Member
More along the lines of "buy this cheap , readily available item and apply like this.."
only without the paywall. Steve Maxwell has an isometric video using a forearm lifting strap that is probably every bit as effective as anything I can advise (if not far superior!). I don't know how well it can be scaled to detrained and elderly, which are the folks that could maybe best make use of this.
My POV, esp after writing down nearly all the general stuff I've learned is that there really isn't that much to it - at least not for GPP. You can get as wonky as you want, but it comes down to "do this".
If you're doing sport specific performance programming then it would be worth it to pay $. In my opinion this is such a basic approach, once you correctly apply a couple of principles there isn't a whole lot more to say.
Last edited:
3letterslong
Level 6 Valued Member
3letterslong
Level 6 Valued Member
I got his video+book awhile ago and didn't know what to think of it. He does 90 second holds like this: first 30 seconds moderate, second 30 seconds almost max, last 30 seconds maximum effort.
Has anyone trained with this scheme before? What kind of adaptations does it create? I can understand North Coast Miller's formula of max tension + metabolic activity for strength and hypertrophy, not sure what to make of Maxwell's formula.
North Coast Miller
Level 9 Valued Member
Thanks! I think a lot of that is bigger lats pushing out my triceps, but in general my arms are def responding to this approach.
The neatest thing about this, there is no doubt that the iso is the biggest effect variable here. I'm not coming off of 2 years of traditional lifting into iso and having "X" effect. I also have a very good idea what 2 sets of submax traditional lifting will do for me, esp in terms of hypertrophy - not bad but is unlikely if not impossible to have an outsized effect.
That goes back to John Little and on to Ken Hutchins Super Slow, basically adapting SS to isometrics. I don't know what to say about this without trying it, except to say I probably won't. I don't think it plays to isometrics strengths.
C. Schwartz
Level 2 Valued Member
Yeah, I appreciate that point, and I get that impression. As someone who works in a diff. kind of education (language acquisition), it's so interesting how simple and effective the principles can be here.
I've done Maxwell's videos too, and they're a pretty good synthesis (reluctant to mention him since I take it he's rather persona non grata here right now). The Forearm Forklift is great!
C. Schwartz
Level 2 Valued Member
As noted above, yeah. For me as sort of an outsider idiot to all of this, it works great. But I'm not being methodical. I'm able to do Simple after having only done this and running for six months, if that counts. The getups feel easier.
3letterslong
Level 6 Valued Member
Oh, cool, I didn't realize that was the same as Timed Static Contraction training. I'm tempted to give it a shot for a brief period of time because I think it'll give me some real control that I'd need to really hit MVC with all my muscles and not just my stronger ones. They have a habit of taking over compound exercises.
3letterslong
Level 6 Valued Member
I've been going through this thread and collecting notes. I think I'm going to give this a shot again. I think I understand Miller's system better, have experienced what proper jolts are, and have fixed some dysfunction in my muscles, so I think I'm positioned to make these work for me.
I think for the first 2 weeks I'll do them Maxwell style and focus on controlling contraction across all the muscles.
Then, for 6-8 weeks, I'll do static hold + high rep calisthenics or HIIT
After that I'll see what my isometric control is like and then start adding in jolts, pulses and forced negatives/moving overcoming holds. I think last time, I didn't have the necessary control to get the most out of this type of training. Overcoming isos are a lot different than yielding isos in that regard -- with yielding, I can just hold myself in the air and all the muscles are doing the same work, but with overcoming my stronger muscles shoot for that MVC and my weaker muscles give up on life and move into their mother's basements.
North Coast Miller, I'm trying to emulate your formula of tension + metabolic exertion. Do you think Extreme Isometrics could be used to generate the metabolic component? They have an eccentric component and I think they would deplete glycogen, but they don't really create much metabolic waste like lactate or heat. An MVC overcoming iso followed by an extreme iso would truly be a have-it-all workout for me... but only if it leads to the same kind of hypertrophy as other methods.
I think for the first 2 weeks I'll do them Maxwell style and focus on controlling contraction across all the muscles.
Then, for 6-8 weeks, I'll do static hold + high rep calisthenics or HIIT
After that I'll see what my isometric control is like and then start adding in jolts, pulses and forced negatives/moving overcoming holds. I think last time, I didn't have the necessary control to get the most out of this type of training. Overcoming isos are a lot different than yielding isos in that regard -- with yielding, I can just hold myself in the air and all the muscles are doing the same work, but with overcoming my stronger muscles shoot for that MVC and my weaker muscles give up on life and move into their mother's basements.
North Coast Miller, I'm trying to emulate your formula of tension + metabolic exertion. Do you think Extreme Isometrics could be used to generate the metabolic component? They have an eccentric component and I think they would deplete glycogen, but they don't really create much metabolic waste like lactate or heat. An MVC overcoming iso followed by an extreme iso would truly be a have-it-all workout for me... but only if it leads to the same kind of hypertrophy as other methods.
North Coast Miller
Level 9 Valued Member
You know what I'm gonna say :
" try it and report back!"
My gut feeling is that you need movement in the muscle - as close to full long/short length, with a bunch of glucose mobilized. You can use intervals, dynamic tension movement, moderate load isotonics...
I don't think another flavor of iso can stand in. If anything you might be able to substitute the MVC for extreme isos and pair that with one of the other options.
3letterslong
Level 6 Valued Member
lol can't argue with that. I think I'll start with the plan as I've laid it out and several months down the line see if I want to try incorporating Exteme Isos + HIIT intervals. Thanks for the advice!
North Coast Miller
Level 9 Valued Member
My advice is to define what you want to accomplish - what do you want to see happen or what are you trying to find out.
Run an 8 week block minimum up to 12 or so. Keep going if the adaptive response is still kicking. Feel free to tack on a week or two if you get a few weeks into a plan and it suddenly feels different.
Commit to the plan for better or worse unless it is a complete disaster. This is the only way you can finish a block with more insight than you began - the only way. In my case it means I experiment with less stuff than I might, but when I'm done with a block I have usable n=1 data. I know what the result was and what the factors were. My next block will tend to "work" well, but the result will be a little different, and I'll know why. On to the next...
Training for Life
Level 6 Valued Member
You could use altitude drops and rebounds for your metabolic component, which would enable you to use a more complete version of the extreme iso system.