Kettlebell RE: Seven Basic Movements--Bent Press?

[kodo kb]

Hey all,

(For those who don't know what I mean when I write "seven basic movements", here's an article about it: The Seven Basic Human Movements - StrongFirst)

I've been working on my bent press with the help of Dave Whitely's book, Taming the Bent Press (by the way, thanks Mr. Whitely!), and was pondering what sort of movement patterns are incorporated into the Bent Press.

Press? Well it ends up overhead, but the triceps and delts don't do anything close to the lionshare of the work.
Pull? This one I think I can say no pretty clearly, but the lat get's pounded.
Hinge? Yes, definitely part-hinge.
Squat? Not really. (At least for my body-type, I don't go deep enough to consider it close to patterning a full squat.)
Loaded Carry? No

Rotation or counter-rotation? Honestly not sure how to judge this one.

I have the sense I am trying to a complex thing into a framework created to simply check if one's training is comprehensive, but being a fitness nerd it's something that's fun for me to think about. I'd appreciate any thoughts on the matter.

Thanks for your time,
Josh

 

[Steve Freides]

Loaded Carry? No

Rotation or counter-rotation? Honestly not sure how to judge this one.

Loaded Carry - Yes, in my book. The Bent press is about supporting the weight and getting under it. If not a carry, then a supporting lift, which is a similar thing.

Lots of t-spine rotation in the bent press - just ask someone with poor t-spine rotation how their bent press is if you're not sure about that one.

-S-

 

[pet']

Hey,

A clean and press, excepted the rotation / counter rotation, is a pretty complete movement, no ?

Kind regards,

Pet'

 

[Iron Tamer]

Push- yes. Just not in the same plane as the military press. Bench ores or a dip is still a press/push in a different plane.

Pull- yes, pulling the elbow back with lats. Pulling the weight in to the shoulder on the clean.

Squat - in a partial ROM, yes for most people. Different degree on each leg.

Hinge- yes, to a different degree in each side

Loaded carry =support, so yes

Rotation and counter rotation are the same action. the factor that limits most folks is a lack of rotation. improvement in rotation = a better bent press.

Bent press = King of Lifts

 

[kodo kb]

Hey Iron Tamer. Thanks for the response. I get those justifications, but now I realize I meant to ask a slightly different question than I originally posted.

So, if anyone could chime to answer this one I'd really appreciate it:

If one does the bent press regularly, what other movement-types should be added to ensure that all movement patterns get proper development? Or to ask the reverse, what movements do a bent press "check-off" when someone is developing a training program?

And Iron Tamer (or anyone else with a lot of experience with the bent press):

Since you mentioned how better rotation leads to better bent presses, would you recommend doing full contact twists to supplement bent press training, or is it better to save my energy on practising the bent press more. (Thanks to you, I'm hooked!)

EDIT: In response to Pet''s (really unsure if I made that possessive form right ) question: I think a one-handed C&P is everything except a squat and carry. (The clean and press require counter-rotation to complete strictly.) The one-arm C&J beats it in my book because of the partial squat one performs. However, as Dan John has said, "If all you did was Clean and Press, you could be awesome."

 

[DavThew]

If one does the bent press regularly, what other movement-types should be added to ensure that all movement patterns get proper development? Or to ask the reverse, what movements do a bent press "check-off" when someone is developing a training program?

I'm really keen to hear a response to this!
I tried running a plan with DFSQ, Bent press and snatches a few months ago, thinking I'd hit most of the movements with this, unfortunately I got my rep scheme totally wrong and fried my CNS with it (also was working a lot of night shifts/long days at the time so sleep and recovery was pretty limited).
My aim was GPP and practised 3-4 times a week, I felt I didn't need a strict upper body pull as I was climbing a fair bit at the time, and didn't feel that I needed more of that. I imagine if I'd reduced my volume on DFSQ and snatches I might have done a lot better!

 

[Al Ciampa]

The problem with classifying nature, and biology, is that things don't quite fit into the boxes that we need to create for an ability to communicate said classifications. While it's advantageous to break things down into pieces for learning and communicating, in the real world, you have to put the system back together for optimal functioning and understanding.

Thomas Meyers illustrated the error in thinking like this with anatomy.

The body just "moves"; out in 3-space; against ~9.81m/s.

 

[Steve W.]

The problem with classifying nature, and biology, is that things don't quite fit into the boxes that we need to create for an ability to communicate said classifications. While it's advantageous to break things down into pieces for learning and communicating, in the real world, you have to put the system back together for optimal functioning and understanding.

Thomas Meyers illustrated the error in thinking like this with anatomy.

The body just "moves"; out in 3-space; against ~9.81m/s.

+1

I have the sense I am trying to a complex thing into a framework created to simply check if one's training is comprehensive, but being a fitness nerd it's something that's fun for me to think about. I'd appreciate any thoughts on the matter.

I agree with your initial assessment. To my mind, the "seven basic movements" is just a construct to guide exercise selection and programming, and shouldn't be treated like some kind of objective and comprehensive description of human movement. It is useful to the extent that it helps clarify your thinking and decision making.