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Old Forum ROP ladders

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bandrade

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Everyone,

There have been several posts on ROP but haven't seen this question. ( hope i'm not proved wrong on that)  Is there a major loss in not taking the ladders to 5? After achieving the full 5 ladders  of 5 with a 24kg,  (and completing other standards of ROP) would i be missing out on much by not taking a heavier bell to the "5th rung"? I would do 5 ladders of 3.... If goal is pure strength and little to no size gain is wanted.... just wondering

-Bri
 
Brian, certain lifts can benefit greatly from improved technique and improved CNS activation without any hypertrophy, e.g., the deadlift, the press is not such a lift.

Part of why the ROP works as well as it does it that it belongs to the family of programs that feature high volume and one heavy day per week.  That's a tried-and-true protocol.

Five ladders to three is the heavy day on the third week of the ROP - there's nothing wrong with that, nothing at all, but if you want to go further, then you will want to keep increasing the volume by getting to five ladders to five.

I have done the ROP twice with a 24 kg and both times was able to get a single with a 32 kg on my test day.  That's huge - train with one weight and get able to 1RM at a 33% higher weight.  Or put another way, train a ton of volume at 75% and nothing higher, and then hit 100% on test day.

If I was looking for a way around that, the approach I'd take would be to find a way to train with some weight between, in my case, 24 and 32 kg - some of that would probably allow me to train with lower overall volume and possibly less hypertrophy.

The purpose of the ROP is to get you to a single with your SFG Level II press, a number that is at or just slightly below 1/2 bodyweight.  (That's 32 kg for me.)  It works great and might very well be the closest thing to a guaranteed training program that I have come across.

So we must ask you a few questions

Why not try to get the next weight up to five ladders to five?

Why be concerned about a little shoulder and upper arm hypertrophy - skip a donut or a beer or both if you need your weight to remain unchanged.  I'm a weight-class athlete and the ROP has never caused me to not make weight at a competition.

One more thing - we saw a few variants on the ROP from Pavel at Plan Strong, specifically in our manuals from that.   You might consider attending the next Plan Strong, or working with someone who attended the first one to discuss your specific goals and have a program designed for you to help meet them.

-S-
 
Sir,

 

Thank you so much for taking time to answer..

I'm not apposed to it, (extra muscle) just looking to gain anymore than needed. I Would rather be stronger than look stronger ;)

From what I have read you and I are around the same weight, so the 32 is my goal as well.... I Was just wondering aloud for those out there who have been in the trenches longer than I. I will keep working the ladders to 5.. :)

thank you so much,

Brian
 
Brian, you're welcome.

After reaching 5 ladders to 5 with the 24 kg bell, you may well be able to press the 32 - I was.

There are many approaches one can take - where are you now, e.g., are you in the middle of the program with the 24 kg?  And do you own a 28 kg, and a 32 kg?

-S-
 
Hi Steve, you answered my questions a few weeks back and I've taken up ROP.  Starting to see the gains in three weeks which is great.  I've read a lot about the variety days in the forum history and many people ask what to do.  I think I fine with what to do, but my question is are they necessary to succeed, or to rephrase are they there to speed up the process or allay the fears of the impatient and those that get bored easily?  Personally, I'd like to be able to do three days as specified with more flexibility, mobility and balance work (such as headstands etc) on the variety days.  What I fear would happen if I opt to do more weights on the variety days is a quick route to cns fatigue (presses seem to affect me like that, I can swing all day but presses really tax my CNS) and over training.

I'd like to think that three days provides sufficient stimulation to build the necessary strength without being side tracked with variety days. especially as the thursday variety day can be pretty intense as written in the ROP.

Perhaps, as my 'engine' get's bigger I'll be able to handle more volume.

Best

Paul
 
Paul, you understand things correctly – do not push yourself hard on variety days, enjoy your lifting, practice lifts easily that target your weaknesses, help loosen things that are tight, improve your mobility – that sort of thing. Stay away from heavy lifting on variety days. It’s more important to follow the spirit of the idea rather than the suggestions given in the book literally – although I confess, I like the idea of a few getups while on the ROP.

-S-
 
Thanks Steve, much appreciated.  I think I may just do some maintainance Goblet squats, 3x3 24kg over the two days, a light TGU on the thursday 3 L 3 R, and light windmills, headstand practice and all the mobility / Original strength stuff.  Or just foam roll and OS if i feel like I'm burning out.

Having come to the KB community from endurance sports I'm finding it hard not to go out and run for an hour, but it's just not possible to balance, maybe when I was 18!

P
 
Paul-> From experience from following the RoP,

I tend to lift to much, so variety days are a _no_ for me.

You do not have to go up every single week, you will still make progress. You can shoot for improving intensity/density/volume. Either is fine. It is a long journey, no need to rush it.

You can also take much longer rest between ladders/rungs. Ex Do one ladder every 3 hours.
>
You can do first ladder one step higher than the rest.
ie:
1,2,3,4,5,
1,2,3,4,
1,2,3,4,
1,2,3.

In my progressions i found it easier to up the rungs once every week, when I came to 5 ladders i started over at 3 with the new "intensity".
My progression (heavy days C&P follows):
1w(week): 3 x 1,2,3
2w: 4x1,2,3
3w: 5x1,2,3
4w: 3x1,2,3,4
5w: 4x1,2,3,4
6w: 5x1,2,3,4
7w: 3x1,2,3,4,5
8w: 4x1,2,3,4,5
9w: 5x1,2,3,4,5
10w: repeat week9
11w repeat week10
12w: try to make 3x3,5,7 (Military press)
13w: try to make 4x3,5,7 (Military press)
14w, try to make 5x3,5,7 (Military press)
 
Mike: Stolen from an old (2009) dragondoor forum post from Peter Hunt, when I was first starting out with kettlebells.
the 3,5,7-part i stole from someone else, I am the master-thief! Probably stole that quote too.
 
Another tweak to the ROP is work on compressing the rest periods a-la ROTK.. credit to Jody Beasly for the idea
 
Thanks SuperJoel,

Sorry if I'm being a little dense what does this mean:

12w: try to make 3×3,5,7 (Military press) 13w: try to make 4×3,5,7 (Military press) 14w, try to make 5×3,5,7 (Military press)

the 5 and 7 are confusing me.  Is that five and seven reps per set?

 
 
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