Old Forum Simple and Sinister swing form check
- Thread starter Ronin135
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Did you notice you lean back a bit? You want to be tall at the lockout
kb dan
Level 3 Valued Member
Agree with Mark on the leaning back a bit. I am one to know about this one....I was a "leaner" back in my early swinging days. To fix this there are three things you can do:
1. Imagine there is a wall behind you on the upswing. Keep the back straight and picture pushing your head up through the ceiling.
2. Planks, planks, planks. If you can get the proper tension right with the plank, you will notice that it will feel more solid at the top of your swing.
3. It's hard to see in video, but make sure to tense the glutes at the top and also pull the kneecaps up. This will help with the proper snap at top of swing and make your "float" a little quicker too with the bell
Hope that helps
1. Imagine there is a wall behind you on the upswing. Keep the back straight and picture pushing your head up through the ceiling.
2. Planks, planks, planks. If you can get the proper tension right with the plank, you will notice that it will feel more solid at the top of your swing.
3. It's hard to see in video, but make sure to tense the glutes at the top and also pull the kneecaps up. This will help with the proper snap at top of swing and make your "float" a little quicker too with the bell
Hope that helps
Mike Lindner
Level 5 Valued Member
Hard to argue with anything from Coach Mark.
One thing that helped me clean up my lean was heavier deadlifts. It gets easy to bully weight around but when it gets heavy you see and feel how your body really reacts.
I'd say in addition to the drills above (Great stuff)
Double kb or barbell deadlifts. Squeeze at the top and really tense the glutes.
Power swings. Focus on really driving that bell up and planking hard at the top. Shoulder to ankles tight.
Hope it helps.
One thing that helped me clean up my lean was heavier deadlifts. It gets easy to bully weight around but when it gets heavy you see and feel how your body really reacts.
I'd say in addition to the drills above (Great stuff)
Double kb or barbell deadlifts. Squeeze at the top and really tense the glutes.
Power swings. Focus on really driving that bell up and planking hard at the top. Shoulder to ankles tight.
Hope it helps.
Steve B.
Level 5 Valued Member
Get some swing instruction from a qualified SFG coach if you can.If not i would recommend Pavel's book Enter The Kettlebell which has lots of instruction on the swing in it.Its hard to just get a movement down without hands on work.
I agree with the others you need to stand tall and tight with the body at the top of the swing as if you are doing a standing plank.Also think projecting the KB out in front of you when you are swinging rather than upward.If the KB slipped out of your hand or hand it would go forward away from you.I'm not trying to knock you and have not seen S&S, but I'm pretty sure you should be proficient in the movements before starting the program.So get good with them before you go any farther.
I agree with the others you need to stand tall and tight with the body at the top of the swing as if you are doing a standing plank.Also think projecting the KB out in front of you when you are swinging rather than upward.If the KB slipped out of your hand or hand it would go forward away from you.I'm not trying to knock you and have not seen S&S, but I'm pretty sure you should be proficient in the movements before starting the program.So get good with them before you go any farther.
Mike Lindner
Level 5 Valued Member
To tag on to Steve's suggestion, StrongFirst recently put out a <a title="DVD" href="http://www.strongfirst.com/booksanddvd/strongfirst-foundation-of-strength-dvd/">DVD</a> that covers the lifts needed in S&S and then some. That would also work if you wanted to go with a more visual source.
A partner drill that has worked well for me is have a partner reach out his fingers stand behind you, if your back touches his fingers, you are leaning back too much
eugene
Level 1 Valued Member
@Ronin135. I am going to mention couple of things in addition to what is said above:
you are dragging the kettlebell before hike, your arms are almost vertical and this makes you start you swing with your back and not your hips. When you park it you press into your knee (2nd video). You rotate to face the camera at the end of the last video. This all could lead to issues with your back. Please be careful.
you are dragging the kettlebell before hike, your arms are almost vertical and this makes you start you swing with your back and not your hips. When you park it you press into your knee (2nd video). You rotate to face the camera at the end of the last video. This all could lead to issues with your back. Please be careful.
Ronin135, thanks for bringing this up. I'm interested in this leaning back issue because I think I do the same thing, but I felt validated when reviewing the SFG instructor certification video that demonstrated the swing standards:
http://www.strongfirst.com/kettlebell-instructor-certification-sfgi/
In that video around the 4:30 mark it appears that at lockout there can be a slight lean (which makes sense when you consider physics) as long as there is a solid plank and the body is still "tall." My takeaway from the video is that the focus should be on a solid plank at lockout, and less on standing exactly vertical, but I could be wrong. It also appears in many of the photos from S&S and ETK that there may be a slight lean back at lockout.
http://www.strongfirst.com/kettlebell-instructor-certification-sfgi/
In that video around the 4:30 mark it appears that at lockout there can be a slight lean (which makes sense when you consider physics) as long as there is a solid plank and the body is still "tall." My takeaway from the video is that the focus should be on a solid plank at lockout, and less on standing exactly vertical, but I could be wrong. It also appears in many of the photos from S&S and ETK that there may be a slight lean back at lockout.
Mike Lindner
Level 5 Valued Member
John - Great point and good observation.
If you want to go by the testing standards, remember that the body forms a straight line on the tops of the swing; the hips and knees extend fully, the spine is neutral.
0:06 into the first video the spine is extended and not neutral. Take note of 4:10 in the SFG video. Technically there is an angle in which Mark's body is "leaning" backwards, but note how the legs are extended fully and the spine is in a straight/neutral position.
That probably would be a better way to address the "leaning back" to the OP looking back on it.
If you want to go by the testing standards, remember that the body forms a straight line on the tops of the swing; the hips and knees extend fully, the spine is neutral.
0:06 into the first video the spine is extended and not neutral. Take note of 4:10 in the SFG video. Technically there is an angle in which Mark's body is "leaning" backwards, but note how the legs are extended fully and the spine is in a straight/neutral position.
That probably would be a better way to address the "leaning back" to the OP looking back on it.
Ronin135
Level 1 Valued Member
I think by lean-back they are mostly pointing to me arching back. I think I was doing this because I was taming the arch wrong. I think Steve is right when he says I need to, "[a]lso think projecting the KB out in front of [me] when [I am] swinging rather than upward." I think doing what Steve suggested and doing the planks Daniel suggested should help.
Steve W.
Level 8 Valued Member
Mike makes an important point. Especially with heavy KBs (Mark is using doubles at the place in the SFG demo video cited by John K), the body may be at an incline relative to the ground. However, the alignment of the body itself is still straight, with fully extended knees and hips and neutral spine.
The problem comes with "leaning back" in the sense of overly extending the lumbar spine.
The problem comes with "leaning back" in the sense of overly extending the lumbar spine.
Mike Lindner
Level 5 Valued Member
Looks like we all came to the same conclusion my phone just posted first.
Heavy weight is the truth, you'll find out where you are leaking real quick.
Heavy weight is the truth, you'll find out where you are leaking real quick.
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