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Kettlebell GS and body type

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Matt604

Matt604

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Hi, I know most here are not training for GS, but I think a few are, and I like this place, so I will ask my question here if that's OK.

I have shorter arms and legs and a relatively longer torso. In the rack position, there is no way I can get my elbows down far enough to rest on my iliac crests. I understand that this resting position is one of the keys to long-duration sets of double jerks or long-cycle. I'm not looking to become a world champion or anything, but I might like to compete locally someday, and I think that would require me to do jerks and not just snatches. I'm just curious to know the experiences of anyone with more or less my build who got into GS -- is this just sort of a non-starter? Thanks in advance.
 
You can pick which one you will do. You can always tilt yourself to the side, and also this is the part where the belt comes useful ;) some tips :

- > practice GS rack , with weights as it will stretch you into the position, also it takes time to develop the rack
-> try gs rack with belt
-> for practice consider tilting to one side as an option, not a perfect one though
-> little joke but still, gain weight, but elbows on the belly ( still, if you don't gain weight you still can put your elbows on the belly)

-> find a coach. :)
 
Hey @Matt604 good question! I wouldn't put it in the "non-starter" category though.

First, I assume you're planning on doubles? (if singles, your solution is much easier)

I'm not sure that I share your body type but when I'm in the rack (competed in Canadian Nationals earlier this year, TALC 100 reps w/ 16k's) my elbows rest on my "belly" (like @taedoju said) not my hip bones. The first thing to go out the window with GS is "appearance", its an ugly rack and everyone looks "fat" haha.

along with the suggestions above (+100 to spend time in the rack. find your "restful" position, it exists you just need time to find it)

one of my big focuses, especially at the beginning was to bring my elbows together as the bells reached the rack (on the clean). Like try and touch them together every time. Now I'm talking Longcycle but it would be similar from overhead back to the rack for the jerk. Keep it tight. at the end of the day GS is all about efficiency, the least possible energy put into each rep and NO wasted energy. Bells go straight up and straight back down.

Also +100 to find a coach. I was inexperienced and ignorant when I got into GS (a dangerous combination haha)I found a great coach and before I knew it, I had a great rack (hehe) and was making big improvements every session. a coach will have a good eye for what you need.

Where do you live? Is 604 your area code?
 
I too suffer from long torso syndrome. My elbows don't come anywhere near my hips...and no amount of training or flexibility work can change that. So, I used a belt and jammed my elbows into that as best I could (ouch).

I also became a Long Cycle specialist. Even though my rack rest was sub-optimal, you can rest with the bells over head, and you can also take an extra back swing or two and get a little break there. That will help keep your shoulders from burning out.

Finally.....do rack holds. While rack rest might never be a strong point, you can make it better.
 
Everyone, I added the tag

Girevoy Sport

to this thread. If someone wants to look up older threads and tag them similarly, that would be great.

I tried to use GS as a tag, but our forum seems to require a minimum of three characters in a tag.

-S-
 
Thanks to all of you for your responses! Quite right that finding a coach is thing one. And I'm glad to hear that it's not an absolute requirement to rest the elbows on the hips.

King Cobra Fit -- I live in the San Francisco Bay Area now, but yes, 604 = Vancouver (born and raised).

Thanks again everyone -- and I'd love to hear more peoples' experiences.
 
Same problem here. Short legs long torso. Add to that I'm fat. I don't like wearing a lifting belt. What I do is make sure that my elbows are tight against my body. My arms end up resting on my gut somewhat. Yes, keeping the elbows in tight requires a bit of muscular effort so it is not as "relaxing" as someone who can rest on their hips or is comfortable wearing a belt and can rest their elbows on top of the belt, but that's okay.

The strategy no one here has mentioned is get to where you can crank out reps the whole time and don't really need to rest. ;)

Overall though I think that GS is a very egalitarian sport. There really isn't an ideal body type.
 
Another body build consideration for the GS rack is the width of the shoulders and the tendency to internally rotate the humerus to get the elbows resting on the belly or iliac crest (my short stature meant a complete collapse to connect elbows). Getting a great coach is as important with GS as it is with hardstyle - to accelerate skill development while reducing injury risk. But I'll also add needing to invest enough time training the counter postures (releasing tightness and strengthening weaknesses).

I've trained a number of GS practitioners who already suffered from lifestyle syndrome - forward head, rounded upper back, forward shoulders and tucked under pelvis. They loved GS since it 'fit' their body so easily.

Learning hardstyle, which works to 'undo' these postural adaptations, was hard. But it's really what they needed most from me. Lots of soft tissue work and movement prep.

As for belts, many competitions don't allow that rest position for elbows...check it out before you make that your default rest if you do plan to compete one day.
 
Martine Kerr said:
As for belts, many competitions don't allow that rest position for elbows...check it out before you make that your default rest if you do plan to compete one day.
Click to expand...
Hi, @Martine Kerr - always nice to see you here.

I haven't heard of anything GS related that didn't allow resting the elbows on the belt - do you know of any specific federations/events that have this rule?

-S-
 
@Matt604 I'm not sure how close or far away from them you are but Google "Ice chamber". They are in San Fran.....somewhere, but have a number of Masters of Sport including the youngest in North America. If you can get in for a few sessions with Sara or Steve you will be in amazing hands. My GF and I went there for a training sessions while in San Fran for a wedding. very well worth the money and time. So much GS wisdom on that team!

@Steve Freides I was under the same impression as @Martine Kerr and thought that I read that the elbows couldn't rest on the belt but I looked at the AKA/IUKL rules about belts and it says "weightlifting belts are allowed: width no more than 12 cm and length no more than 1.5m. The belt may not be worn under the uniform. Fabric (towel/t-shirt) cannot be placed over the belt." no mention of elbows resting on the belt.
 
I took a GS coaching cert a while back - no mention of not resting the elbows and it was strongly encouraged. And if you couldn't reach, you just did the best you could in terms of finding a good resting position for yourself.

-S-
 
I recall reading (discussing?) that the only point of wearing a belt is to rest the elbows. Even with double 32s, the weight is not heavy enough to require the support of a lifting belt.

King Cobra Fit said:
The belt may not be worn under the uniform. Fabric (towel/t-shirt) cannot be placed over the belt."
Click to expand...

This implies that the belt is there to rest the elbows. The technique is to wear the belt loose and dig the elbows inside the belt. The hard edge can get uncomfortable, which is why a competitor would even bother to wear the belt under the uniform or wrap it in a towel - to add a cushion. Otherwise this would look dorky. But this is not allowed (perhaps to avoid the dorkiness).
 
One other trick that I know a lot of athletes will use is to spray water on the area of your shirt that your elbows will land. This will help your elbows "stick" a bit better. (as long as your shirt is cotton)
 
In most organizations, resting on the belt is now illegal. Some of the heavyweights will use a belt to pinch up a shelf of belly fat to rest the elbows. +1 for spraying water and finding a coach.

I have trained long cycle for years. I'm not that good, but I'm just now getting to the point of seeing good, sustainable progress with my gs posture. Here's what I'm figuring out about the rack: rock back.

Leaning back is bad news for your lumber spine, which is why Pavel correctly gives it a thumbs-down. However, I'm learning to rock back from my hips (rather than leaning back from my lower back). My elbows rest on my stomach, and the bells rest on my chest. When I start a jerk, I'm looking almost straight up at the ceiling. It feels awkward at first, but in this position, the weights feel light in the rack, I can recruit my glutes to get a stronger launch, and the throw my hips under the bells faster in the lockout. The more I work on this, the better it gets. I usually end up with some bruising on my stomach where the elbows it, and it is a few inches above my iliac crest.

I'll see if I can get a video up in the next few days.
 
Thanks so much for all the responses. Some great thoughts here.

Physical Culture, I'm trying to picture the "rock back" you describe. Is it a forward thrust of the hips?

Bought your book, by the way. Great stuff. I think it will change the way I think about training long term.
 
Matt604 said:
Thanks so much for all the responses. Some great thoughts here.

Physical Culture, I'm trying to picture the "rock back" you describe. Is it a forward thrust of the hips?

Bought your book, by the way. Great stuff. I think it will change the way I think about training long term.
Click to expand...


Thanks. I really appreciate it! The rock back I am describing involves attempting to thrust the hips forward, without significantly altering the relationship of the lumbar spine to the pelvis, if this makes sense. Rather than exaggerating the bend in the lumbar spine, the relationship between the pelvis and femur changes.

It probably feels more like lying back than it really is, for those of us who are so accustomed to being upright or even in flexion.
 
My word cues for "rock back" would be keep knees, hips, and shoulders all in straight line while leaning back from the knees; knees and shoulders rotate around central point approximately at the waist or hips
 
Thanks again everyone -- and thanks for posting the video. That makes sense now.

Physical Culture -- I tried to send you some questions about your book using a "conversation" -- let me know if that didn't come through. I'm not exactly sure how all this fancy new media stuff works.
 
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