Old Forum S&S shadow swings

[ali]

Ladies & Gents

After discovering the delights of continuous swings recently I was thinking about shadow swings, or overspeed eccentrics, if they are the same thing that is. I'm on timed sets with the 32 and do continuous swings every couple of weeks or so, as S&S. So with shadow swings is it better to keep to 10 sets of 10 with short rests with a 24 (or lighter even) or rest as required? I remember Al Ciampa posted a video on technique of overspeed eccentrics and thinking they are the  same thing. Never done them before so any pointers gratefully received. Cheers

 

[ali]

Found Al's video on the blog and re-read S&S......all sorted

 

[Al Ciampa]

Alistair,

My understanding of "shadow swings" is that they are identical to "overspeed eccentric swings", as Pavel has described in the past.

The swing that I "discovered", and demonstrate in that video, was actually borne out of my misreading the description of the original overspeed eccentric swing, and, not getting with an SFG for clarification.  Through my incorrect practice of the overspeed eccentric, I "think" that I molded a different swing.  It's a subtle difference, but it is there, and those who I have taught it agree.

Although it takes some bit of finesse to get right, you'll experience the difference through increased heart rate and trunk development - training these for even a short while will put to rest any question of the swing's effect on sit-up performance.

I think my description of that swing here is still pretty good:

http://www.strongfirst.com/hardening-the-soldier-for-combat/

Arresting the bell's ascent is the key ...  a violence of action is also required.

 

[ali]

Thanks Al. How would you program them? In S&S Pavel says to do overspeeds on light days, with a lighter bell. I'm presuming 10 sets of 10, as is the swing in S&S and again I'm also presuming rests as required, as it is a light day. There is a difference isn't there, between 100 continuous swing tests and light days? And in your piece you suggest, 10 overspeeds, 10 l, 10r, rolling sets to 90-120. Any difference? Bearing in mind, I was thinking of doing overspeeds as a lighter practice!! Thanks again Al. Great piece by the way. I had read it before but re-read again. I'm non-military but it makes a lot of sense and looks a pretty solid program for anyone and everyone. Cheers

 

[Al Ciampa]

Alistair,

I've found that there is a "sweet spot" in bell size for these overspeeds that everyone has to find for themselves.  Assuming you're training for alactic-power, it's lighter than your regular 2-hand swing bell, and may be the same load as your 1-hand swing bell.  Experiment.  As I am thinking about it right now, this swing may be one of the best ways to challenge the alactic fuel system ...

The program I suggest is not S&S, and not just in semantics ... so, one or the other.  But if you want to use a infrequent variety session during your S&S training to practice these swings, then sure, do sets of 10.  You may find that you will need more rest between sets, so don't set a clock.  You will also find that its takes less time to do a set of these swings, due to the faster pace, so don't swing past the point of high power production - when the bell slows down in either direction, end the set.

As always, take your time to perfect your technique.

 

[ali]

Thanks again Al for the details. Tried them yesterday and your comments pretty much match my conclusion after trying them out. I tried 10 sets of 10 with a 24 and started timing at 30 secs a set with some 1 handed too, as in your blog and figured I could as that was the point I moved to the 32 in S&S. After set 6, I finished them all 2 handed but switched the clock off and rested a lot, lot longer than I had anticipated for! Next time I'll go for a 16, go for speed and technique, as an experiment again to see how it goes/compares.  It was meant to be a light day too - as an infrequent variety day as you say - but they were pretty challenging, grip and forearm particularly. Kind of makes sense given the increase of force on the downswing. I went for the usual get ups afterwards but had to go light with them. Know now what to expect the next time - I'll switch the clock off and focus on the technique as they do feel different!

 

[guacadoggie]

Shadow Swings are great! I don't usually do them on light days because I feel like it takes a bit of extra-good energy to keep the force generation high throughout the whole thing. In other words, I have to be in the same mindset as when I do a heavy day. My following TGUs usually can only go as heavy as my light day, though. My lats and forearms are VERY tired after Shadows.

In S&S, it says to use a bell that's 1/3 your bodyweight. For me, it's the 28kg - which I don't have. So I've tried the 24kg and the 32kg, and the 32kg seems slightly too heavy for me.