Question 32 to S&S standard. Or add in a 36?

Discussion in 'Simple and Sinister FAQ Questions' started by Brad May, Jul 28, 2019.

  1. Brad May

    Brad May Still New to StrongFirst Forum

    I have a question if I may?
    Should I be adding a 36 in before I have reached Simple or insisting on the simple standard before I start with the next weight?
    Here’s the background.
    I’ve been training S&S for about 18 months. I hope to reach Simple by Christmas. I would say I’m solid with the 32 on both swings and get ups, training most days and slicing off about 15 seconds from each every month.
    I’ve added in a 36 and I’m now adding one set of OH swings x 10 and one get up each side the the 36 most work outs. It feels really heavy (probs 9/10 effort).
    I would also add I really love the simplicity of S&S.
    So, should I be starting to include the 36 as I am, or sticking with the 32?
    Oscar likes this.
  2. Steve Freides

    Steve Freides Forum Administrator Senior Certified Instructor

    @Brad May, welcome to the StrongFirst forum.

    The answer to your question is, "It's all good."

    I'd do both - keep working in the heavier weight, but also do some sessions with a focus on achieving the Simple standard with that weight. The former should help the latter.

  3. Oscar

    Oscar Quadruple-Digit Post Count

    Im started using the 40 before reaching Simple and it helped a lot. I did sets of 5 with it.
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  4. william bad butt

    william bad butt More than 300 posts

    In general, if you are starting to ask yourself this question, then I would sprinkle in some higher weights.
  5. Steve Freides

    Steve Freides Forum Administrator Senior Certified Instructor

    If I can tease this out a little, I'd say it's good to use the next weight up so long as you can use it safely. If it's really wobbly, I wouldn't. If you can execute one good rep with it, then you're OK. And if you're not sure, get a spotter for the first few times you try to go heavier.

    Brad May likes this.
  6. Brad May

    Brad May Still New to StrongFirst Forum

    Many thanks. So sounds like it’s a good plan to continue to strive for simple, getting that time down and focusing on form. Plus adding in the 36 a few times a week. When I do I forget about times and muster the additional effort. Hopefully one set of swings/ get up a few times a week will start to add up. Thanks for your thoughts.
    Oscar likes this.
  7. Mark Limbaga

    Mark Limbaga Quadruple-Digit Post Count Elite Certified Instructor

    Yes you can but only on days you feel really good.

    Remember that the ideal practice of S and S is its a recharge to power you up for whatever tasks you will undertake or whatever life throws at you
  8. Pavel Macek

    Pavel Macek More than 2500 posts Master Certified Instructor

    My suggestion is:
    - reach the 100 swings and 10 get-ups with 36 (don't rush against the clock) to build strength reserve
    - after you reach it, for 2-4 weeks, have one harder session/week - not necessarily the 5+10 mins of the test, but close enough - peaking
    - 3rd or 4th session, do the Simple test with 32
  9. Molson

    Molson Double-Digit Post Count

    Interesting thread. Would you advise the same but with 40kg instead? I did buy 28kg and never used it for 24-32kg period, so i’m not planning to but 36kg at all.
  10. Pavel Macek

    Pavel Macek More than 2500 posts Master Certified Instructor

    Molson likes this.
  11. Phi' D'

    Phi' D' Still New to StrongFirst Forum

    Hi Brad,

    This is a very relevant topic for me as I hit the Simple goal today for the first time :)
    My experience training with a size up before hitting this goal - I've only done so with for TGUs, mixing in the 36, and 40 - it feels great, so why not if you're already doing 5+5 within 10 mins with 32 - even if swings are lagging behind. I also like to go slow with a 24kg, or bottoms up (16), and sometimes ladders, 1,2,2, and eventually 1,2,3, followed by 1,2,3 the next side (20/24kg). You've got the strength but want to master the movement, so don't forget your lighter bells!

    I enjoy swings, but less ;), and so never bothered to swing heavier than 32 during my S&S sessions, focussing on getting time down. 10x10 1H swings with the 32 ain't easy, and just a couple of weeks ago when it was taking me 22-26 minutes. Shaving time from 10 swings EMOM, as it sounds you have been, felt like a battle, where any progress was countered by a slower TGU time. Does this sound familiar to you?

    Here's the bit that I hope will help you towards hitting Simple, which is the real goal isn't it?

    I read this article by Michael Perry A Solid Game Plan for Acing the Snatch Test | StrongFirst, only substituting 24kg snatch for 32kg 1H swing.

    I jumped into phase 3 (5x16, switching hands after 8) and was amazed when first time I pulled off 80 swings in the 5 mins! I found the 5 sets in 5 mins much easier to recover from than doing 10 over a longer period. This was a week ago. I did two more sessions, and then today did phase 4 of mentioned article (5x20 emom) and hit the Simple Goal (woop!).

    It would be awesome if you could achieve your Simple goal earlier than expected, as I did by trying this simple approach!
    Bauer and Brad May like this.
  12. Brad May

    Brad May Still New to StrongFirst Forum

    Some awesome advice here so thanks to everyone. Here’s what I’m taking from it

    1. It’s good to add that extra weight but not so much that it kicks your ar$e for the next day.

    2. Mix it up with some alternative programmes BUT keep reverting to the simple goal. As Dan John says - keep the goal the goal.

    3. Focus on the 100 swings / 10 get ups with the heavier weight BUT forget the clock. To build strength reserves. Keep testing the S&S standard.

    I must add that I love S&S. It really works for me, all done in a short time, never knackered and I can see me continuing for the long term. The 48 beast feels like a long way off though. It’s gotta be a year down the line before I truly own the 36 even.....
  13. Brad May

    Brad May Still New to StrongFirst Forum

    And many congrats on getting to simple. I know the effort and commitment it takes. Almost there
  14. Sparker

    Sparker Second Post

    Hi Brad,

    For what it’s worth, I achieved Simple a week ago. I have been sprinkling in some 36kg reps. It feels like building more volume with the 36kg is the best way for me to build enough reserve to achieve Simple on ‘almost any day’.


    Bauer likes this.
  15. Brad May

    Brad May Still New to StrongFirst Forum

    Just read the article. I’m going to see how I can work that in. Looks like I could switch it out a few days a week. All the best. Brad
    Tiger likes this.

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