Given your weight, working up to strengthening pushups and pike pushups (while simply grooving your press) will also be a prudent plan..
Clean & Press Ladders - Help moving beyond 32
- Thread starter Blackstar
- Start date
You need heavy weight, a lot of volume, and frequency (3x/week).
If you want more muscle, you need heavy weight, a lot of volume, frequency, and density (more work in less time).
Thus, the reason the Rite of Passage (ROP) has you work up to 5 x 1-2-3-4-5 Ladders (75 reps) with a heavy weight following a Heavy, Medium, Light schedule (weight stays the same but the volume varies each day).
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AJL
Level 2 Valued Member
Just throwing this out there:
Have you given any thought to how much weight you are trying to press per week?
Read this article if you get some time:
In it the author discusses the concept how how advanced it is to press 3000kg per hand per week. That is a volume he worked UP TO in his journey to press The Beast.
A fully maxed week of 32kg RoP has ladders of 1,2,3,4,5, or 15 reps per hand per ladder. There are 5 ladders on the heavy day, 4 on medium, 3 on light. That’s 12 ladders of 15 reps per hand, or 180 reps per hand.
180 reps x 32kg = 5760kg per hand per week, or almost double what many Beast Pressers work up to.
I don’t second guess RoP at all, but the article makes a good point about excessive volume.
To press a lot you must press a lot.
But maybe double the weight of a Beast Presser’s max week is too much?
Have you given any thought to how much weight you are trying to press per week?
Read this article if you get some time:
My Journey to the Beast: Pressing a 48kg Kettlebell | StrongFirst
To press a lot, you must press a lot. One man's patient quest to press the Beast by combining building and peaking phases—accumulation and intensification.
www.strongfirst.com
In it the author discusses the concept how how advanced it is to press 3000kg per hand per week. That is a volume he worked UP TO in his journey to press The Beast.
A fully maxed week of 32kg RoP has ladders of 1,2,3,4,5, or 15 reps per hand per ladder. There are 5 ladders on the heavy day, 4 on medium, 3 on light. That’s 12 ladders of 15 reps per hand, or 180 reps per hand.
180 reps x 32kg = 5760kg per hand per week, or almost double what many Beast Pressers work up to.
I don’t second guess RoP at all, but the article makes a good point about excessive volume.
To press a lot you must press a lot.
But maybe double the weight of a Beast Presser’s max week is too much?
Not sure if this would work exactly for you but when I could finish the ROP (Jurassic) with a 28kg bell, I could press the 40kg.
That progression is simple go from 5 x (1,2,3) to 10 x (1,2,3), then from 3x(1,2,3,4) to 6x(1,2,3,4), then from 2x(1,2,3,4,5) to 5x(1,2,3,4,5). The volume always moves from 30 to 60 and every time you hit a 60, you drop the volume and increase a rung on the ladder. Simple, effective, and time-tested. Since you are already doing 5x(1,2,3), you can continue to progress the 32kg bell progression along the path above and I would be fairly confident that you should be able to press 40 after this. The only thing I would add is to not rush through it. You don't need to progress to the next step every session. If you find 7x(1,2,3) challenging, then stick with it for a couple of sessions and once that starts feeling a bit easier move on to 8x(1,2,3).
Hope that helps.
That's actually a very insightful discussion.Just throwing this out there:
Have you given any thought to how much weight you are trying to press per week?
Read this article if you get some time:
My Journey to the Beast: Pressing a 48kg Kettlebell | StrongFirst
To press a lot, you must press a lot. One man's patient quest to press the Beast by combining building and peaking phases—accumulation and intensification.www.strongfirst.com
In it the author discusses the concept how how advanced it is to press 3000kg per hand per week. That is a volume he worked UP TO in his journey to press The Beast.
A fully maxed week of 32kg RoP has ladders of 1,2,3,4,5, or 15 reps per hand per ladder. There are 5 ladders on the heavy day, 4 on medium, 3 on light. That’s 12 ladders of 15 reps per hand, or 180 reps per hand.
180 reps x 32kg = 5760kg per hand per week, or almost double what many Beast Pressers work up to.
I don’t second guess RoP at all, but the article makes a good point about excessive volume.
To press a lot you must press a lot.
But maybe double the weight of a Beast Presser’s max week is too much?
My strongest pressing came not from doing a lot of kettlebell pressing but when I was doing some barbell overhead pressing and just grooving my kettlebell press.
Here's a little math 105lbs (total on bar) x5,5 = 1050
24kg (which is about 53 pounds) x 1,2,3x3 : 954
So you get more total weight moved. Just be very watchful of your recovery
Pete L
Level 6 Valued Member
I got my double 24s from a 7RM to 9RM in about 5 weeks from doing the same.
PTTP barbell on an evening and the early weeks of Strong! on a lunchtime.
So the DB KB presses were singles or doubles and the barbell load was increasing daily.
The PTTP barbell press has a lot of good stuff eh?
Adachi
Level 7 Valued Member
getting a 36kg bell is definitely one way to go.
Part of my path to pressing the 40kg bell was definitely jerks, and push presses.
I was able to play with minimizing the amount of kipping involved to up the intensity on my shoulder.
Big-time stimulus.
Practicing Strength Aerobics / Iron Cardio style singles (of 40kg Jerks and PushPresses) definitely helped me get there.
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Dydo
Level 5 Valued Member
I currently weigh 111 kg. and I'm making some effort to lose weight. I lost about 5 kg. My first goal is to drop below 100 kg, but even drop to 90 kg. I don't know if I'll ever be able to press KB 40kg, which won't be half my body weight. I don't even want to think about it anymore. At the moment, my shoulder press with a barbell is about 60 kg, and with KB things are more difficult. I guess if your barbell max is 64kg, you won't be able to press KB 32kg. with one hand.
Washed up Meathead.
Level 5 Valued Member
If you don't believe you will ever press a 40KG you never will. Believing you can do is half the battle, Self belief when it comes to lifting is vital.
It may be a long road but if you want it bad enough you can do it. Get your strict barbell press up and keep working with kettlebell pressing, lots of volume with submaximal loads and you will progress. It just takes time.
For the vast majority Overhead pressing is a slower progressing exercise but keep at it and it will start moving, consistency is key here.
I'm training to be able to press the 40kg strict as well and I will do it because I believe I can do it. When i do it is another matter, I don't know how long it will take and it will be a lot of hard work but when I do it's going to be Great day.
Dydo
Level 5 Valued Member
I haven't used any strict programs, but since I'm a regular at the gym, I had a moment when I did a shoulder press with a barbell of 70 kg. Maybe it's the years, maybe it's because I don't recover well /I used to live this way/ but I've become weaker in all exercises. And at the same time, at the same body weight, where I had more strength, my muscles were smaller. For example, when I used to weigh 111 kg. I had an arm circumference of 42 cm and a legs of 62-63 cm and I was doing a shoulder press with 70 kg. for one repetition, bench press 110-115 kg. etc. Now I'm 111 kg again, my legs is 67 cm, my arm is almost 44 cm, but with a lot of effort I can lift a bench press of 100 kg. and a maximum shoulder press of about 60 kg. I can't squat with a 100kg barbell. With more muscles, but weaker in weights.
It must be from age and circumstance that I have incorporated more machines into my training and removed many of the core exercises. I haven't done squats and deadlifts that are heavy in a long time. I haven't even done heavy deadlifts in over a year. But this is due to medical reasons.
Otherwise, I agree, I will get the thought into my head that at some point I should be able to press KB 48 kg. so that I can press at least 40 kg.
It must be from age and circumstance that I have incorporated more machines into my training and removed many of the core exercises. I haven't done squats and deadlifts that are heavy in a long time. I haven't even done heavy deadlifts in over a year. But this is due to medical reasons.
Otherwise, I agree, I will get the thought into my head that at some point I should be able to press KB 48 kg. so that I can press at least 40 kg.
Washed up Meathead.
Level 5 Valued Member
Your body composition sounds like it has changed and judging by the lifts it probably has. Arm and leg size is pretty irrelevant without knowing bodyfat level and how they look.I haven't used any strict programs, but since I'm a regular at the gym, I had a moment when I did a shoulder press with a barbell of 70 kg. Maybe it's the years, maybe it's because I don't recover well /I used to live this way/ but I've become weaker in all exercises. And at the same time, at the same body weight, where I had more strength, my muscles were smaller. For example, when I used to weigh 111 kg. I had an arm circumference of 42 cm and a legs of 62-63 cm and I was doing a shoulder press with 70 kg. for one repetition, bench press 110-115 kg. etc. Now I'm 111 kg again, my legs is 67 cm, my arm is almost 44 cm, but with a lot of effort I can lift a bench press of 100 kg. and a maximum shoulder press of about 60 kg. I can't squat with a 100kg barbell. With more muscles, but weaker in weights.
It must be from age and circumstance that I have incorporated more machines into my training and removed many of the core exercises. I haven't done squats and deadlifts that are heavy in a long time. I haven't even done heavy deadlifts in over a year. But this is due to medical reasons.
Otherwise, I agree, I will get the thought into my head that at some point I should be able to press KB 48 kg. so that I can press at least 40 kg.
If you have pressed 70kg overhead you can get back and more there no doubt.
I'm chasing a 70kg press myself but only at 67.5kg strict. It was only 62.5kg a few months back though so I'm progressing nicely.
I'm sure if you start training like you used to the strength will come back and your overhead will move again.
mrwhy
Level 5 Valued Member
A lot of good suggestions here.
A few other tools to throw in the box
- do a few sets of "trying to press." Clean it and then try to press. Move onto doubles. Then triples. Both of clean and try and clean press/press/press. (meaning clean, try to press, clean, try to press....as well as clean, try to press, relax slightly, try to press again.)
- use the little push to press it. Do singles with the little push. Then move to doubles with the little push. Then little push triples. Same as above, mix in both clean and little push presses along with clean press/press/presses.
- Overhead carries - clean, push press, take a short walk. Bell down repeat.
Basically you're acclimating your body and tendons to the weight. Right now 40kg "feels" heavy. Your'e training your body to where 40kg is just 40kg.
There are different ways to work this into the overall program.
A few other tools to throw in the box
- do a few sets of "trying to press." Clean it and then try to press. Move onto doubles. Then triples. Both of clean and try and clean press/press/press. (meaning clean, try to press, clean, try to press....as well as clean, try to press, relax slightly, try to press again.)
- use the little push to press it. Do singles with the little push. Then move to doubles with the little push. Then little push triples. Same as above, mix in both clean and little push presses along with clean press/press/presses.
- Overhead carries - clean, push press, take a short walk. Bell down repeat.
Basically you're acclimating your body and tendons to the weight. Right now 40kg "feels" heavy. Your'e training your body to where 40kg is just 40kg.
There are different ways to work this into the overall program.
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Pete L
Level 6 Valued Member
I can barbell MP around 60 kg and get 4 reps with 32 kg on right and 2 on the left
Joel the Savage
Level 6 Valued Member
My 2 cents for progressing. Alternatives:
1. Increase density for the ladders. When you can do 5x1,2,3,4,5 on your heavy day start over at 3x3,5,7 increase every week to 5x3,5,7, repeat 2 more times.
2. Use elastic rebound from your ribcage to gain extra speed of your chest. Sort of a mini push press. Use these as the first rep/reps in the ladders.
3. When you can do the above press, do singles of them throughout the day. Maybe 1 press every hour. (You can double bicep-curl it to the chest, the press is the important part here)
4. Just push press it. Make less push as you get stronger.
1. Increase density for the ladders. When you can do 5x1,2,3,4,5 on your heavy day start over at 3x3,5,7 increase every week to 5x3,5,7, repeat 2 more times.
2. Use elastic rebound from your ribcage to gain extra speed of your chest. Sort of a mini push press. Use these as the first rep/reps in the ladders.
3. When you can do the above press, do singles of them throughout the day. Maybe 1 press every hour. (You can double bicep-curl it to the chest, the press is the important part here)
4. Just push press it. Make less push as you get stronger.
Blackstar
Level 1 Valued Member
For anyone interested - in the last few minutes managed to strict press the 40kg - 1 rep each side. Noticeable difference in form though as you really have to stabilise the core to get it above the head. To get there was greasing the groove with the 32 and also built in some barbell OHP to my training. This is a massive milestone for me.
Blackstar
Level 1 Valued Member
Great points here. I am going to continue with the 40 doing 1 press several times through the day and build in more volume with the 32. The limiting factor isn't actually the lifting - it's the calluses when re-cleaning the bell. Have had to work on my clean technique quite a bit!
GreenSoup
Level 6 Valued Member
That is surprising. Shocking even.My Journey to the Beast: Pressing a 48kg Kettlebell | StrongFirst
To press a lot, you must press a lot. One man's patient quest to press the Beast by combining building and peaking phases—accumulation and intensification.www.strongfirst.com
In it the author discusses the concept how how advanced it is to press 3000kg per hand per week. That is a volume he worked UP TO in his journey to press The Beast.
A fully maxed week of 32kg RoP has ladders of 1,2,3,4,5, or 15 reps per hand per ladder. There are 5 ladders on the heavy day, 4 on medium, 3 on light. That’s 12 ladders of 15 reps per hand, or 180 reps per hand.
180 reps x 32kg = 5760kg per hand per week, or almost double what many Beast Pressers work up to.
I don’t second guess RoP at all, but the article makes a good point about excessive volume.
To press a lot you must press a lot.
But maybe double the weight of a Beast Presser’s max week is too much?
I just started Geoff Neupert's Easy Muscle. The first week is the easiest. It was as easy as it was described but easy does not mean "low on pressing." I did some quick math and realized I exceeded 10,000kg in pressing volume! More than 3x the weekly KG a Beast Tamer used and I am nowhere close to that strong!
Harder weeks are ahead and they promise an increase in volume. Although strength is a side effect of this hypertrophy program I look forward to seeing what this does to my strength.