Other/Mixed Painful push-ups - front delts

[Anna C]

Up next is training for OAPU for the Dome and StrongFirst recertification. Master SFG Karen Smith is making me a program for the next 6 weeks. If I'm able to get there, I know her path is the best one to take! I found that I can use my jerk blocks and bands for regressions and I'm looking forward to working on this.

Ideally, I get the OAPU in April, and then move back into weightlifting after that... but we'll see. If it's not meant to be, I have plenty of other training options. Being pain free and fully functional is the main win, and I'm pretty much there already.

Revisiting this thread one more time to report that I did the 6 week program from Karen in March and April and it was VERY effective. I was able to rebuild my strength in OAPU training 4 days per week for 6 weeks, various assisted versions and singles, plus ISO holds and other related work that all came together to get that OAPU I needed to retest. The OAPU was there on recert test day at the Dome.

Since then I've done 2 weeks of transition training back into weightlifting and loading overhead, and now into 1st week of actual weightlifting again, with barbell snatches and jerks of decent weight. I was also able to do 24 kg TGUs again the other day. So far, so good. Shoulder is doing alright, mobility is much better, and the pain has not returned. It had first started about a year ago, and progressed slowly to the point it was when I started this thread in October. It finally started improving when I got the steroid shot and ceased the overhead barbell training back in mid-February, continuing the PT, and changing up my training. So, it has been a long journey.

I think the lesson for me was, one of my favorite quotes: "If you do not change direction, you may end up where you are heading." - Lao Tzu. In this case, what started out as a small problem just kept heading steadily down the wrong path. I needed to change it up, cease doing the thing that was aggravating it for a while, address weaknesses, rebuild, then start back in. Not easy to do when there's a certain type of training you really want to do, but there are many options, no matter the constraint. To keep training, and just doing what you can do while giving your body a chance to heal is the important thing. And of course, taking care of yourself.

 

[3letterslong]

Revisiting this thread one more time to report that I did the 6 week program from Karen in March and April and it was VERY effective. I was able to rebuild my strength in OAPU training 4 days per week for 6 weeks, various assisted versions and singles, plus ISO holds and other related work that all came together to get that OAPU I needed to retest. The OAPU was there on recert test day at the Dome.

Since then I've done 2 weeks of transition training back into weightlifting and loading overhead, and now into 1st week of actual weightlifting again, with barbell snatches and jerks of decent weight. I was also able to do 24 kg TGUs again the other day. So far, so good. Shoulder is doing alright, mobility is much better, and the pain has not returned. It had first started about a year ago, and progressed slowly to the point it was when I started this thread in October. It finally started improving when I got the steroid shot and ceased the overhead barbell training back in mid-February, continuing the PT, and changing up my training. So, it has been a long journey.

I think the lesson for me was, one of my favorite quotes: "If you do not change direction, you may end up where you are heading." - Lao Tzu. In this case, what started out as a small problem just kept heading steadily down the wrong path. I needed to change it up, cease doing the thing that was aggravating it for a while, address weaknesses, rebuild, then start back in. Not easy to do when there's a certain type of training you really want to do, but there are many options, no matter the constraint. To keep training, and just doing what you can do while giving your body a chance to heal is the important thing. And of course, taking care of yourself.

That's fantastic! It sounds like an arduous journey, but you did it!

I'm just curious if you're going to keep the OAPUs in rotation, even if just for maintenance, or if you're going to put it aside totally and perahps resume it again some time in the future. After all that work, I don't know if I could just stop training it.

 

[watchnerd]

I needed to change it up, cease doing the thing that was aggravating it for a while, address weaknesses, rebuild, then start back in. Not easy to do when there's a certain type of training you really want to do, but there are many options, no matter the constraint. To keep training, and just doing what you can do while giving your body a chance to heal is the important thing. And of course, taking care of yourself.

Welcome to shoulder fun for Masters weightlifters!

I'm so glad you feel better now, though. Believe me, I understand the frustration of hitting that wall and not being able to train overhead.

I could write a whole essay on a sustainable pattern for heavy overhead work I finally managed to reach after years of trial and error, but it basically comes down to *tons* (ridiculous, perhaps) of upper body exercise variety and big deload blocks after pushing the overhead weight envelope during competition blocks.

 

[Anna C]

That's fantastic! It sounds like an arduous journey, but you did it!

I'm just curious if you're going to keep the OAPUs in rotation, even if just for maintenance, or if you're going to put it aside totally and perahps resume it again some time in the future. After all that work, I don't know if I could just stop training it.

Thanks! Yes, to some degree I'll keep them in the rotation, mostly the regressions and assistance exercises that focus on core/plank/tension and not so much the specific pushing strength. The OAPU is SO good for that, and I really was missing that in almost-exclusively sagittal plane training I was doing.

 

[Anna C]

Welcome to shoulder fun for Masters weightlifters!

I'm so glad you feel better now, though. Believe me, I understand the frustration of hitting that wall and not being able to train overhead.

I could write a whole essay on a sustainable pattern for heavy overhead work I finally managed to reach after years of trial and error, but it basically comes down to *tons* (ridiculous, perhaps) of upper body exercise variety and big deload blocks after pushing the overhead weight envelope during competition blocks.

Yes, sounds about right! I have a feeling there are more lessons ahead...

 

[Don Fairbanks]

Thanks! Yes, to some degree I'll keep them in the rotation, mostly the regressions and assistance exercises that focus on core/plank/tension and not so much the specific pushing strength. The OAPU is SO good for that, and I really was missing that in almost-exclusively sagittal plane training I was doing.

Your testing side for the OAPU is your dominate side, and the side without pain ?
Any AHA moments with your rehab, or was it the kitchen sink over several weeks ?

 

[Anna C]

Your testing side for the OAPU is your dominate side, and the side without pain ?

Yes, fortunately. So I tested on the right side, which was stronger. But I did all the training on both sides. The left was about 70% as strong, so I used more assistance.... like this.

Any AHA moments with your rehab, or was it the kitchen sink over several weeks ?

Mostly kitchen sink, a little bit of many things, and time. All of these things helped!

 

[Don Fairbanks]

Yes, fortunately. So I tested on the right side, which was stronger. But I did all the training on both sides. The left was about 70% as strong, so I used more assistance.... like this.


Mostly kitchen sink, a little bit of many things, and time. All of these things helped!

Nice, and yes, I remember you Kitchen Sink post. I need to take a picture of it and make into a poster.

 

[Aziatik]

@Anna C i haven't read through everything here but just some thoughts from a bodyworker who trains - might be the pain of adaptation as your pec major tendons beef up again to adapt to the load. Literally growing pains. That just takes time and patience to work through the discomfort.

Also as mentioned it could be a bicep tendon issue but unlikely or a deltoid trigger point thing or a sub scap issue. In any case find a chiro or physio or bodyworker that does graston and cupping, may electro stim too and has a lot experience with the shoulder. Do the work and get the modalities applied. They do wonders to accelerate adaptations and healing.

As for homecare - get an orbital car buffer, a sharper image massage gun and some voodoo floss. Apply to your sore spots as needed while you grow. You shouldn't have any problems a couple of months with any push up angles. Aim for ring pushups later on to train stability. This from a guy who has worked through tons of shoulder injuries, imbalances, discomforts.

If you can't do it, don't. If you can and have dull bothersome pain, than do it and if it makes it worse, back off a little and apply modalities to accelerate adaptation. If you have sharp pain that is accompanied by serious inflammation and or bruising go get checked right away, then get right back on it when you are cleared. Sometimes people are a bit overcareful dealing with discomfort and pain. More often than not working through it and with it has helped me more than stopping and restarting....frequent stimulation of the the dysfunctional tissue increases bloodflow and lymph passage, thereby accelating healing.

I did read in and see this was an old post and now you're good to go. Adaptation to the pec attachment would have been my guess... Adaptation and thickening of a tendon that went unstressed for a long time. Saludos!

 

[Abishai]

I've been neglecting push-ups lately, and need to get back to them.

My problem is that my shoulders are super painful when I try to do push-ups. It feels to me like the anterior deltoids, but could be something else in that vicinity. I don't think it's an injury because it's the same on both sides, and it doesn't feel structural -- more like soft tissue related. I'm thinking it's either something I'm doing or not doing. I have never had this problem before, but for this instance it does seem to have been coming on for many months - first mildly annoying, but now more of a problem. Then the more I avoid push-ups, the worse it seems to get.

I started revisiting the massage balls (Tune Up brand, like lacrosse balls but a little softer) this week, and foam rolling. Wow! It really seemed to help! Lots of tension in there. I will definitely continue that and that might be enough, but thought I'd see if anyone has any more ideas.

My resistance training has been almost all barbell weightlifting for the last 2 years - barbell snatch, clean, jerk, squat, and various lift variations. I also do lots of walking and cycling, but hardly any kettlebell or bodyweight resistance training (other than core). There is a link to my training log in my signature block for more specific training details.

Does anyone have any thoughts or suggestions to help resolve this issue.

Kelly Starret MOBILITY WODS is the way to go for that,
Try to figure out if its a ROM issue or a fascia/hotspot.
Many of my clients have had this issue and and a mixture of lacrosse ball and focusing on proper torque helped.

 

[Anna C]

I did read in and see this was an old post and now you're good to go. Adaptation to the pec attachment would have been my guess... Adaptation and thickening of a tendon that went unstressed for a long time. Saludos!

Sounds logical and that's more good advice to add to this thread! Thanks!

Kelly Starret MOBILITY WODS is the way to go for that,
Try to figure out if its a ROM issue or a fascia/hotspot.
Many of my clients have had this issue and and a mixture of lacrosse ball and focusing on proper torque helped.

Yeah, I still don't know where the pain was coming from, or how much it was related to my overhead issues and left shoulder pain... but it is way better now. Thank you!

 

[ChiBill]

Kelly Starret MOBILITY WODS is the way to go for that,
Try to figure out if its a ROM issue or a fascia/hotspot.
Many of my clients have had this issue and and a mixture of lacrosse ball and focusing on proper torque helped.

Do you have any experience with the "golfers elbow" protocol? It always flares up on me when I try to add chinups or pullups into my programs. I really like to do those but always end up with issues.

 

[Abishai]

Do you have any experience with the "golfers elbow" protocol? It always flares up on me when I try to add chinups or pullups into my programs. I really like to do those but always end up with issues.

Yes.
one of the biggest causes of golfers elbow is an inbalance in forearm/grip strength and/or tight triceps.
I had it for a few months when I was chasing a one arm pullup.
a combo of soft tissue lacrosse ball work,ROM work and Captain of Crush gripper work was the ticket.
I will try to post a video of the specifics.

As a side, I have a friend who powerlifts and he got tendonitis .
when he returned to DLs after working on his gripwork his lift was 75 lbs more.

 

[Os Aponte]

Hi Anna. I have some ideas, and I can send you some videos to see if it helps. I will be opposite joint mobilization with opposing action. So, in this case, hip circles in extension. Changing eye position to see if it yields pain-free reps, various sensory stimulation, vibration, hot/cold, light touch vs. heavy pressure, and finally, breathing in different patterns.

 

[malleus]

I've been neglecting push-ups lately, and need to get back to them.

My problem is that my shoulders are super painful when I try to do push-ups. It feels to me like the anterior deltoids, but could be something else in that vicinity. I don't think it's an injury because it's the same on both sides, and it doesn't feel structural -- more like soft tissue related. I'm thinking it's either something I'm doing or not doing. I have never had this problem before, but for this instance it does seem to have been coming on for many months - first mildly annoying, but now more of a problem. Then the more I avoid push-ups, the worse it seems to get.

I started revisiting the massage balls (Tune Up brand, like lacrosse balls but a little softer) this week, and foam rolling. Wow! It really seemed to help! Lots of tension in there. I will definitely continue that and that might be enough, but thought I'd see if anyone has any more ideas.

My resistance training has been almost all barbell weightlifting for the last 2 years - barbell snatch, clean, jerk, squat, and various lift variations. I also do lots of walking and cycling, but hardly any kettlebell or bodyweight resistance training (other than core). There is a link to my training log in my signature block for more specific training details.

Does anyone have any thoughts or suggestions to help resolve this issue?

It is in croatian, but you will get the point. It heleped me a lot...

 

[Anna C]

Hi Anna. I have some ideas, and I can send you some videos to see if it helps. I will be opposite joint mobilization with opposing action. So, in this case, hip circles in extension. Changing eye position to see if it yields pain-free reps, various sensory stimulation, vibration, hot/cold, light touch vs. heavy pressure, and finally, breathing in different patterns.

Hi Os, always interested in what you have! However the thread is old, so I've moved beyond the original problem and mostly back to normal training at this point.... Though problems do sometimes reoccur so I'm always open to suggestions.

 

[Os Aponte]

Anna, I must insist that you share any issues with me. I promise to wait at least a year before I try to be "helpful."