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Barbell Back Squat and Deadlift on a single session

What do you think about the plan


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mikhael

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Recently, after completing a session on which I did Back Squat along with Deadlift with a pretty good numbers (Back Squat 1x242 lbs (110 kg), and Deadlift 1x352 lbs (160 kg)), I stared considering to follow a plan focusing on the two lifts. Both performed in a single session. The following came to my mind, and what to share it with you, and ask about your opinion.
What do you think, and would you follow it for some time?

BACK SQUAT & DEADLIFT

Intensity
(% of 1RM)
Light: 70%
Medium: 80%
Heavy: 90%
Volume
Low: 5/1
Medium: 3/3
High: 5/5

Weekly schedule (Intensity/Volume)
MON
BSQ: Light/High
DL: Heavy/Low

WED
BSQ: Medium/Medium
DL: Medium/Medium

FRI
BSQ: Heavy/Low
DL: Light/High
 
What's the progression plan? How often have you been deadlifting and squatting per week so far?

On Monday, I'd want to do the deadlift before I did the volume squats.

I wouldn't have a problem following the plan if I was used to the frequency (3x squat + 3x deadlift) and couldn't make progress doing less. That seems like an odd thing to say but especially when I've had an active job, with things like barbell squats and deadlifts, I wanted to do as little as I needed to keep progressing.
 
FYI, Korte 3x3 is considered as one of the best powerlifting templates - bench, squat and deadlifts 3 times a week. Not something you should follow for a long time without the break, though.
 
BACK SQUAT & DEADLIFT

Working The Same Muscle Groups

They both work the same muscle groups, as you know.

Exercise Order

The first exercise in a training program is going to elicit a greater training effect than the one that follows.

Your program has to some degree taking that into consideration.

However, let's break it down some more.

Training Both On The Same Day

The Deadlift take more out of the Squat than the Squat take out of the Deadlift.

That is the primary reason in Powerlifting, the Squat is the first lift and the Deadlift is the third lift.

In the beginnning of Powerlifting the lift order was...

1) Bench Press

2) Squat

3) Deadlift


The order was eventually changed to...

1) Squat

2) Bench Press

3) Deadlift


Since the Squat and Deadlift employ the same muscle groups. it allow more recovery for the Deadlift.

With that said, here are some other alternatives...

Combined Squat-Deadlift Training

1) Monday


A Llight Squat followed your Heaverier Deadlift Training.

With this method, the Squat is essentially a Warm Up for your Deadlift.

2) Friday

A Heavy Deadlift followed by a Very Light Squat; due to the muscle fatigue from the Deadlift.

3) Wednesday

No Squat or Deadlift.

Here's Why

1) Ressearch by Dr Fred Hatfield determined that the Larger Muscle Groups in the Lower Body require longer more days; with up to 6 says of recovery necessary.


2) Research by Dr Tom McLaughlin found that the Lower Back is quickly and easily OverTrained; more so for Conventional Deadlifter due to greater lower back invovmement than Sumo Deadliftss, with less lower back involvement.

3) Also, what many fail to consider is how much the Lower Back is taxed with the Squat.

The Lower Back (core) is also worked to lesser degree with Standing Movement Exercises; which which contributes to OverTraining, muscle fatigue.

Powerlifter Deadlifting Training

Many Powerlifter only train the Deadlift once ever 7 - 10 days, sometime only every other week due to the Lower Backs need for recovery. There appraoch is based on anecdotal, partical exerience from decades of training.

Thus, a Training Program more in line with a Powerlifting Plan would be...

1) Monday: Squats

A good Auxiliary Deadlift Exercise following the Squat would be Moderate Repetition Kettlebell Swings with a Moderate Load, Hip Extension/Back Raises, etc.

2) Friday: Deadlifts

Good Auxiliary "Squat" Exercise following the Deadlift for the Squat would be movement the minimize the work load on the Lower Back, placing the workload on the Legs: Belt Squats, Step Up, Bulgarian Split Squats, etc.
 
Stronglifts 5x5 & Starting Strength have both lifts together on a linear progression. If your numbers aren't big, your body can handle it.
531 has both together with a level of autoregulation if youre intermediate or your percentages vary. But they're not both heavy on any day.
If your weights are past several hundred pounds, together would be taxing.
 
You could run Reload.
Mondays and Thursdays
Monday would be Back Squat (heavy day) Deadlifts (light day)
Thursday would be Deadlifts (heavy day) Back Squat (light day)

There's plenty of other days you could fill with other things.
 
I stack BSQ and DL on the same day all the time, but the specific progression matters a lot more than whether you do or don't do the exercises together.
Yep. Lots of variables at play. I spent a couple of years doing PTTP deadlifts every day, and squatting a couple of times per week, but the DL was never terribly heavy.
It’s not how I’m lifting any more, but I would say give doing both lifts on the same day a shot and see how you like it. Worst case you learn that it doesn’t work for you and try something else.
 
Yep. Lots of variables at play. I spent a couple of years doing PTTP deadlifts every day, and squatting a couple of times per week, but the DL was never terribly heavy.
It’s not how I’m lifting any more, but I would say give doing both lifts on the same day a shot and see how you like it. Worst case you learn that it doesn’t work for you and try something else.
What sets and reps did you use for the squats?
 
I did SQ & DL 3x/week, using heavy weights (70% - 85%). BUT...the volume was lower than you are suggesting, and waved. It went OK, but as I recall it was only for four or six weeks.
 
Depends on the programming but easily doable. I would push squat hard one session and ease up on DL and then push DL hard on next session and ease up on squats. Conjugate does this regularly and I have been doing it for 2-3 years. I have tips if you want them, DM me
 
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