Antti
Level 10 Valued Member
Double overhand? No mixed or hook grip?
Other/Mixed Curls: A Big Waste of Time?
- Thread starter watchnerd
- Start date
Other strength modalities (e.g., Clubs), mixed strength modalities (e.g., combined kettlebell and barbell), other goals (flexibility)
Double overhand? No mixed or hook grip?
watchnerd
Level 8 Valued Member
Hook grip
North Coast Miller
Level 9 Valued Member
I aways include a few sets of tri extension or curls at the end of a session. Not a waste of time for me, way too useful when manipulating stuff in front of/outside my center of gravity. This going along with the thread on chest development.
watchnerd
Level 8 Valued Member
Triceps isolation work is the opposite of biceps for me -- I get very good results.
Benjamin Renaud
Level 8 Valued Member
I find hammer curls and reverse curls help keep my elbows happy. I just do a couple of sets twice a week.
MikeTheBear
Level 6 Valued Member
I've had a similar experience. It seems my "ancillary muscles," for lack of a better term, get bigger and stronger with compound exercises or "functional movements." An example of what I consider a "functional movement" is rucking on uneven terrain. Since I started rucking a few weeks ago my calves have increased in size very nicely.
I've also noticed that this isn't just limited to "ancillary muscles." When I did more Olympic weightlifting I noticed my upper back strength increased significantly despite not doing any rows or pull-ups. Pavel noted this in The Quick and the Dead (I just picked up a copy) - trainees who did nothing but kettlebell snatches improved their pull-ups. I can confirm that this is true. I also did lots of push presses as assistance work for Olympic weightlifting and my bench press improved despite not benching. I've actually considered doing nothing but the Olympic lifts and squats for my general strength program (I don't plan on competing any time soon but I still enjoy doing the lifts), add in some kettlebell work for variety and to get in some higher reps and calling it good.
TL;DR Drop the curls if you don't get anything out of them.
watchnerd
Level 8 Valued Member
I might keep a nominal amount curls just for elbow health in snatches, but I don't think I need 8-10 sets a week.
I bet I can get away with 4 sets a week (2 sets, twice a week).
FWIW, here is a video from Jordan Shallow on incline DB curls (one of the variations where I can feel the stretch doing something) for powerlifters for lowbar squat purposes.
(although, as a weightlifter, I don't have the issues Jordan talks about given no low bar squats, no bicep ruptures from mixed grip DL, and generally good shoulder mobility)
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Tom Flint
Level 6 Valued Member
My wife would concur with your wife!
Kev
Level 6 Valued Member
I’ve been physically active my whole life just about and I’ve never had big biceps. I’ve been told I have big arms but I’ve always been more concerned about the forearms and the tricep. My mate the blacksmith maintained that big biceps helped the deadlift and he even constructed a weird curl device that isolated the bicep (he’s a tad eccentric). I’m with Arthur Jones for arm growth ie chins and dips though I must admit the pelican curl is now and always will be in my repertoire. When I was into climbing I developed this big massive tendon that was inside both my arms and that mofo impressed me more than anything I’ve ever developed. I don’t climb anymore so it’s went away. As for bulges that impress the women, I think if we are all honest it’s your wallet bulge. Certainly not any muscle.
Kev
Level 6 Valued Member
I’m more and more convinced that any kind of pull-up or chin-up qualifies as an ultimate upper body move. I feel the same about dips too. Most people blow at pull-ups and chin-ups (I know I do) so it’s a level of development that at best gets token use and at worst, utterly neglected. I think I’m going to just completely up the amount of time and volume I spend pulling on a bar.
Fyreman
Level 6 Valued Member
Good morning y’all,
The foundation of my coaching regardless of the tool would be compound lifts which obviously work your biceps enough to produce development. I started to take on some high school male athletes and again use the basic lifts as my foundation and/or the main course. But here recently I let them finish up with curls for the girls. They look forward to dessert. Like Mom said “No dessert without eating your vegetables”.
The foundation of my coaching regardless of the tool would be compound lifts which obviously work your biceps enough to produce development. I started to take on some high school male athletes and again use the basic lifts as my foundation and/or the main course. But here recently I let them finish up with curls for the girls. They look forward to dessert. Like Mom said “No dessert without eating your vegetables”.
guardian7
Level 6 Valued Member
Have you ever tried "straight arm strength" like gymnastic exercises? Isometric holds of your whole bodyweight? L-sits? Dumbbell (very light!) "curls" with straight arms like a flye but not chest height!
watchnerd
Level 8 Valued Member
Yes.
They don't do a lot for my biceps, as many of the weights I use on multi rep barbell exercises that feature a static hold with straight arms, such as RDLs (120kg - 150 kg), already exceed my bodyweight, i.e. more than what I weigh on rings or hanging from straight arms from a pull up bar.
And ring L-sits seem to mostly hit my triceps.
They sure work some stabilizers, though.
For rings, Pelican Curls are probably the biggest impact on biceps I've found.
But I put any ring work in the "compound exercises" category that is already effective.
The issue isn't growing my biceps -- it's just whether curls are worth the time given the better effects I already get from compounds.
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Philskies
Level 3 Valued Member
Greatest gains I ever got were through Mentzer HIT style, single sets to failure. So if time is an issue, it won't be with HIT because one set takes 60 seconds and it takes 7-10 days to recover so there's no need to do any other biceps during that time. However, not everyone likes doing it HIT style, so there's that. Or if you don't want your biceps to get TOO BIG. 
Adam R Mundorf
Level 6 Valued Member
How brutal were those sessions? I've heard some horror stories...Greatest gains I ever got were through Mentzer HIT style, single sets to failure. So if time is an issue, it won't be with HIT because one set takes 60 seconds and it takes 7-10 days to recover so there's no need to do any other biceps during that time. However, not everyone likes doing it HIT style, so there's that. Or if you don't want your biceps to get TOO BIG.
Philskies
Level 3 Valued Member
I do Doug Brignole's Brig-20 exercises, which are basically all isolation exercises, which combined with the HIT approach is not that painful. I know Doug's name has never been brought up on these forums, but his bio mechanics teachings have changed the way I train strength/hypertrophy. It's a very physics based approach to choosing and rating how efficient a particular exercise movement is at stimulating muscle.
If I were to use the HIT approach on big compounds like squats/deads, then yes, that would absolutely be insanely brutal, but not as efficient as the isolations. I find that compounds have a lower stimulus to fatigue ratio.
watchnerd
Level 8 Valued Member
Greatest gains I ever got were through Mentzer HIT style, single sets to failure. So if time is an issue, it won't be with HIT because one set takes 60 seconds and it takes 7-10 days to recover so there's no need to do any other biceps during that time. However, not everyone likes doing it HIT style, so there's that. Or if you don't want your biceps to get TOO BIG.
HIT was before my time, so I don't know how the protocol works.
How heavy are you going?
Are you just picking a light weight and repping out until exhaustion?