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Other/Mixed Kettlebell calisthenics hybrid program?

Other strength modalities (e.g., Clubs), mixed strength modalities (e.g., combined kettlebell and barbell), other goals (flexibility)

WarrenEllis

Level 4 Valued Member
Hi all. Due to recent life changes I no longer have access to barbells. I spent the past few years on several SF programs with success, most recently Reload. Achieved a 2.2xbodyweight deadlift.

I’ve always integrated kettlebells. After years of not training them, I can still bang out one armed pushups. For reference, I have experience with Naked Warrior, S&S, PTTP, ETK, Reload, as well as other materials such as Get Strong, Convict Conditioning, some Dan John materials, and so on.

I’ve completed “simple” a few years ago. I’ve done rounds of ETK-ROP, and competed NW as well, though I’ve since lost my pistol. I’ve recently tested myself at 300 snatches/30 mintes 16kg, 300 swings/30 minutes 24 kg.

I have 16, 24, 32 kg bells. I have a pull-up bar. Does anyone have a bodyweight-kettlebell program I can reference? Work toward simple again, then ETK-ROP with squats? Add NW to either program? Looking for suggestions before I commit to an idea Monday.

Thanks in advance.
 

Mark Limbaga

Level 8 Valued Member
Elite Certified Instructor
A few options..

1. Follow a kettlebell based program. Use easy strength or GTG for a bodyweight movement like pullups/pistols

2. The ROP has a suggestion to do pullups/chinups alternated with your presses

3. @Geoff Neupert has a hybrid burn extreme plan which combines double bell work with some upper body pulling..
 

WarrenEllis

Level 4 Valued Member
I like the id
A few options..

1. Follow a kettlebell based program. Use easy strength or GTG for a bodyweight movement like pullups/pistols

2. The ROP has a suggestion to do pullups/chinups alternated with your presses

3. @Geoff Neupert has a hybrid burn extreme plan which combines double bell work with some upper body pulling..

I like the idea of doing ROP, as it incorporates swings, snatches, presses, and pull-ups. My concern is I won’t maintain my deadlift and there’s very little leg work aside from the prescribed warm up.

I like the idea of incorporating pistols and OAPs but I don’t like the idea of doing them throughout the day (NW). Perhaps 5x5 alternating, twice a week, on my non ROP days?
 

Mark Limbaga

Level 8 Valued Member
Elite Certified Instructor
I like the id


I like the idea of doing ROP, as it incorporates swings, snatches, presses, and pull-ups. My concern is I won’t maintain my deadlift and there’s very little leg work aside from the prescribed warm up.

I like the idea of incorporating pistols and OAPs but I don’t like the idea of doing them throughout the day (NW). Perhaps 5x5 alternating, twice a week, on my non ROP days?

5x5 twice a week may be too demanding on your recovery IMHO. Perhaps something leaning more towards easy strength??

How much are you looking at numbers wise for your DL and what can you comfortably swing/snatch?
 

John K

Level 7 Valued Member
I like the idea of doing ROP, as it incorporates swings, snatches, presses, and pull-ups. My concern is I won’t maintain my deadlift and there’s very little leg work aside from the prescribed warm up.
Just a comment, then two options. Don't be concerned about your deadlift tanking. You are in a season where barbells aren't an option; your deadlift will most likely drop - but that's OK, because when you have access to barbells again your deadlift strength will quickly come back. Don't be concerned that cleans aren't training your lower half; they are.

Two options -
1. Add a set of 5 front squats at the top of each ladder. This isn't ROP as programmed, but there are quite a few programs out there that use the ROP ladders and add in front squats at the top of the ladder. So to be clear you do 1-5 reps with clean and press, then after the 5th rep (the last ladder rung), you do a set of 5 front squats. Laid out:
Clean and Press 1 Right, 1 Left​
Clean and Press 2 Right, 2 Left​
Clean and Press 3 Right, 3 Left​
Clean and Press 4 Right, 4 Left​
Clean and Press 5 Right, 5 Left​
Front Squat x 5 (if you have doubles, use them; if not, 5 right at the top of this ladder, and at the top of your next ladder do 5 left).​
2. Put front squats or pistol work (and whatever other work you want) on your variety days (Tuesday and Thursday traditionally). I'd probably lean towards this option, just because 5 ladders of 1-5 + swings takes a while and can get quite tiring.

@Mark Limbaga mentioned @Geoff Neupert 's Kettlebell Hybrid Burn Extreme, and I'd second that as well.
 

WarrenEllis

Level 4 Valued Member
5x5 twice a week may be too demanding on your recovery IMHO. Perhaps something leaning more towards easy strength??

How much are you looking at numbers wise for your DL and what can you comfortably swing/snatch?
I always log numbers, with routines like reload I’d plot out what I’ll do for 8 weeks and log whether I accomplished my goals daily.

I’ve completed simple in the past. I’ve also recently tested myself 30 EMOM for 30 minutes for 300 reps, 24kg on swings, 16 on snatches.
 

WarrenEllis

Level 4 Valued Member
I think this is how I’ll proceed, option 2 in particular. I can’t bb squat currently so front squats would be with the 32kg.

I’d like to retrain the pistol, but any insight on how effective these are for strength training? I enjoyed training them in the past but I worry, although a display of leg health, aren’t worth retraining for strength. I’d prefer to learn these, use them for my squat, and add weight once I’m proficient, but only if they’re an effective strength exercise compared to weighted bilateral squats.

Just a comment, then two options. Don't be concerned about your deadlift tanking. You are in a season where barbells aren't an option; your deadlift will most likely drop - but that's OK, because when you have access to barbells again your deadlift strength will quickly come back. Don't be concerned that cleans aren't training your lower half; they are.

Two options -
1. Add a set of 5 front squats at the top of each ladder. This isn't ROP as programmed, but there are quite a few programs out there that use the ROP ladders and add in front squats at the top of the ladder. So to be clear you do 1-5 reps with clean and press, then after the 5th rep (the last ladder rung), you do a set of 5 front squats. Laid out:
Clean and Press 1 Right, 1 Left​
Clean and Press 2 Right, 2 Left​
Clean and Press 3 Right, 3 Left​
Clean and Press 4 Right, 4 Left​
Clean and Press 5 Right, 5 Left​
Front Squat x 5 (if you have doubles, use them; if not, 5 right at the top of this ladder, and at the top of your next ladder do 5 left).​
2. Put front squats or pistol work (and whatever other work you want) on your variety days (Tuesday and Thursday traditionally). I'd probably lean towards this option, just because 5 ladders of 1-5 + swings takes a while and can get quite tiring.

@Mark Limbaga mentioned @Geoff Neupert 's Kettlebell Hybrid Burn Extreme, and I'd second that as well.
 

John K

Level 7 Valued Member
I’d like to retrain the pistol, but any insight on how effective these are for strength training? I enjoyed training them in the past but I worry, although a display of leg health, aren’t worth retraining for strength. I’d prefer to learn these, use them for my squat, and add weight once I’m proficient, but only if they’re an effective strength exercise compared to weighted bilateral squats.
Strength is about progression, and about how you are going to measure it. Once you regain your pistol, you would then have to progress in any number of ways (more reps, more weight, longer reps, or increased density are the "main" ways). An easy thing to do would be to train pistols as a skill and then squat. If you develop the pistol you will get stronger, but if your goal is to to do double kettlebell squats or barbell squats, then I would primarily train those and add the pistol in as flavor or on a light day.
 

BJJ Shawn

Level 6 Valued Member
I think this is how I’ll proceed, option 2 in particular. I can’t bb squat currently so front squats would be with the 32kg.

I’d like to retrain the pistol, but any insight on how effective these are for strength training? I enjoyed training them in the past but I worry, although a display of leg health, aren’t worth retraining for strength. I’d prefer to learn these, use them for my squat, and add weight once I’m proficient, but only if they’re an effective strength exercise compared to weighted bilateral squats.

I just happened to read this earlier today:


“More Load on The Legs​

While the total external loads used for single leg squats are typically less than in bilateral squats, the overall load on the legs is actually higher due to a phenomenon known as the bilateral deficit, which means that the sum of the forces produced by each leg is greater than the total bilateral force production.”
 

Steve Freides

Staff
Senior Certified Instructor
Elite Certified Instructor
@WarrenEllis, I compete in powerlifting (in the old, skinny, raw division). The best maintenance for my barbell deadlift I've found is the kettlebell swing. My educated guesstimate is the kind of swing that benefits me the most is about 10% of the weight of my barbell 1RM, done Q&D style. But I also do heavier 2h swings, and heavier-than-Q&D-would-like 1h swings.

-S-
 

Kev

Level 5 Valued Member
Hi all. Due to recent life changes I no longer have access to barbells. I spent the past few years on several SF programs with success, most recently Reload. Achieved a 2.2xbodyweight deadlift.

I’ve always integrated kettlebells. After years of not training them, I can still bang out one armed pushups. For reference, I have experience with Naked Warrior, S&S, PTTP, ETK, Reload, as well as other materials such as Get Strong, Convict Conditioning, some Dan John materials, and so on.

I’ve completed “simple” a few years ago. I’ve done rounds of ETK-ROP, and competed NW as well, though I’ve since lost my pistol. I’ve recently tested myself at 300 snatches/30 mintes 16kg, 300 swings/30 minutes 24 kg.

I have 16, 24, 32 kg bells. I have a pull-up bar. Does anyone have a bodyweight-kettlebell program I can reference? Work toward simple again, then ETK-ROP with squats? Add NW to either program? Looking for suggestions before I commit to an idea Monday.

Thanks in advance.
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