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Off-Topic Low Back Limitation

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Wifi

Level 3 Valued Member
Hello!

My KB training has been going very well, I am past Timeless Simple, chipping away towards Timed, by integrating the 40kg timeless per S&S 2.0. It has improved my strength and recovery in basically everything else I do, but I find when performing manual labor (moving stuff around, lifting children, chopping/sawing wood, etc), my low back is always the weak point. Any ideas on why that is, and how to remedy it?

Thanks!
 
Wifi said:
Hello!

My KB training has been going very well, I am past Timeless Simple, chipping away towards Timed, by integrating the 40kg timeless per S&S 2.0. It has improved my strength and recovery in basically everything else I do, but I find when performing manual labor (moving stuff around, lifting children, chopping/sawing wood, etc), my low back is always the weak point. Any ideas on why that is, and how to remedy it?

Thanks!
Click to expand...
What makes you think it is weak?
 
Wifi said:
Hello!

My KB training has been going very well, I am past Timeless Simple, chipping away towards Timed, by integrating the 40kg timeless per S&S 2.0. It has improved my strength and recovery in basically everything else I do, but I find when performing manual labor (moving stuff around, lifting children, chopping/sawing wood, etc), my low back is always the weak point. Any ideas on why that is, and how to remedy it?

Thanks!
Click to expand...

Dumping load into lower back because of weak core + glutes and/or lack of motor control /good movement patterns of those areas is common.
 
Philippe Geoffrion said:
What makes you think it is weak?
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That's where I feel the burn while doing the work. Oddly enough, no matter how much I push through it, I don't feel any soreness or aching afterwards.

watchnerd said:
Dumping load into lower back because of weak core + glutes and/or lack of motor control /good movement patterns of those areas is common.
Click to expand...
Maybe I have good swing/TGU movement, but not applying the good movement patterns in the work I'm doing?

Boris Bachmann said:
Most people have crappy movement and mobility of the hips and t-spine/shoulder complex and that leads to low back issues. Work on strengthening and mobilizing those and you'll be in better shape. Making sure the abs are solid is never a bad thing.

How's your weight?
Click to expand...
Good to know. I'm working on hip mobility by working towards the splits, both front and side. Any good comprehensive shoulder/T-spine mobility resources? I'm 5' 11", 165lbs, 22yo. Have been since I stopped growing a few years ago, but since I started training my body fat has gone down.

Steve Freides said:
Since you're fine swinging, add the barbell deadlift to your training.

-S-
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Interesting. I always thought swings/snatches were a direct KB substitute for the deadlift. I practice S&S 4 days/wk, with MAF running on separate days, plus a rest day. How would you recommend adding in deadlifts?
 
watchnerd said:
Entirely possible.

People have a lifetime of patterning outside the narrow (and temporally brief) world of what they train intentionally.
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+1

We tend to be much more conscious of what we're doing when we are training. When we do day-to-day stuff, we move more "reflexively" and thus can be unknowingly using all sorts of movement compensations. \

A short, but not necessarily easy answer would be "slow down a bit and pay more attention to what you're doing." It might sound tedious at first, but paying closer attention to your body (how it feels, where you feel pressures, weight,tension, etc) throughout the day can be very enlightening.
 
Wifi said:
I always thought swings/snatches were a direct KB substitute for the deadlift.
Click to expand...

No. Complimentary lifts? Absolutely. One helps the other? Yes.

Wifi said:
I practice S&S 4 days/wk, with MAF running on separate days, plus a rest day.

How would you recommend adding in deadlifts?
Click to expand...
Drop 1 S&S day, replace with main deadlift day. On one of your three S&S days, add light/easy DLs.

-S-
 
Apply the scientific method. I would stop doing swings for 2 weeks. See whether that has a negative, positive, or neutral impact when doing manual labor. Does your back feel better or worse? If neutral or negative, go back to swinging, as is... If yiur back feels better then something is wrong with your swing or you have something wrong with your back (flexion intolerant, for exame, like me). Then report back and discuss. Don't etc a small problem grow into a big problem.

My thoughts. Good luck!

Eric
 
Wifi said:
Hello!

My KB training has been going very well, I am past Timeless Simple, chipping away towards Timed, by integrating the 40kg timeless per S&S 2.0. It has improved my strength and recovery in basically everything else I do, but I find when performing manual labor (moving stuff around, lifting children, chopping/sawing wood, etc), my low back is always the weak point. Any ideas on why that is, and how to remedy it?

Thanks!
Click to expand...
Typically, this is a sign of a lack of strength endurance in the lower back.

You can do all the swings and heavy deadlifts you want, but they won't fix this. The back extensors definitely need higher rep work (think back extensions) to build strength endurance.

And this is not unusual for any of us. Manual labor with lots of bending over tends to expose this particular weakness in people (myself included).
 
renegadenate said:
You can do all the swings and heavy deadlifts you want, but they won't fix this. The back extensors definitely need higher rep work (think back extensions) to build strength endurance.
Click to expand...

In weightlifting, we do back extension accessory work because, even though we pull from the floor and squat with insane frequency already, the lower back endurance (not maximal strength) ends up being the one of the two main limiters on training volume.

(shoulders being the other)
 
Lots of great thoughts on this thread. Just to throw on my votes:
  1. Per @watchnerd 's first comment, building "core" strength (whatever that is exactly) is a great way to promote back health. For me, I feel like working on hanging leg raises and the ab wheel seem to have done a lot to keep my back healthy.
  2. I'd also say the barbell deadlift is a great core strength builder - so +1 to @Steve Freides suggestion
  3. I think for many people, lower back fatigue is the limiter on lifting training volume. Certainly true for me. Respect what the body is telling you, don't try to push through that stuff.
 
WhatWouldHulkDo said:
  1. I'd also say the barbell deadlift is a great core strength builder - so +1 to @Steve Freides suggestion
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I cannot hold myself up as a model for others, but in my individual case, I stayed away from kettlebell swings for a number of years after my back injury while building up my deadlift. It's my opinion - again, just that - that it's much easier to move slowly when you're dealing with an injury, easier and frankly less frightening - whether that risk is real or imagined isn't for me to say, but I didn't like the feeling of the bell swinging back. (FWIW, snatches didn't bother me, only swings.)

All that said, I now swing a kettlebell almost every day, so I don't mean to suggest that because I had a back injury, one shouldn't swing a kettlebell, just, well, you get the idea.

-S-
 
Grizzlyman said:
Serious…if you’re feeling the burn in your back you need to take a hard look at your form when swinging. 40kg ain’t no joke and you can cause some serious injury. I would say “strong” guys can power through bad form up to about 40kg …then it’s a recipe for disaster.
Click to expand...
To clarify - I don't feel the burn while swinging at all. Only when performing manual labor.


Thank you everyone - I'll have to implement deadlifts and back strength endurance now! I'll also work on being more aware of my form while working.
 
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