Kettlebell Navigating through the StrongFirst KB universe

[Adam R Mundorf]

People should stick with a program for a long time. Minimum 3 months. But preferably six months. They should get a solid taste of boredom. When the going gets tough the tough keeps going with the same training program.

I think people are way to creative and are too much seeking originality, entertainment and theory. Ross Ennamit once said wrote that Originality is overrated. That is so true.

This of course also applies to me. I would probably have been superstrong had I just stuck with one training program for a very long time.

So the right question is: When should you change your program ? The answer would be: Later. After you have achieved your goal. What about your feelings ? Write about it in your diary. Talk to a friend about it. But stick to the same program, and don't change your training program in order to feel a short kick of happiness.

You're preaching to the choir about program hopping. Anyone here can see how many times I've started and stopped. Stick to it but also, choose a program that's conducive to your lifestyle, occupation and scheduling demands.

 

[Anders]

You're preaching to the choir about program hopping. Anyone here can see how many times I've started and stopped. Stick to it but also, choose a program that's conducive to your lifestyle, occupation and scheduling demands.

I like your honesty. I preach to those still living in sin

 

[Halfakneecap]

It took me months to get through KB Strong, I had a few minor injuries so had to work around and then come back to it, I also had to drop to twice a week as I adapted to the volume. I also started to get sick of the thought of yet more C&P. Like, staring at the bells thinking “Fu$@ing more?!?” haha

But i made a lot of progress, and got stronger definitely, so was absolutely worth it and I will do it again.

 

[Bauer]

People should stick with a program for a long time. Minimum 3 months. But preferably six months. They should get a solid taste of boredom. When the going gets tough the tough keeps going with the same training program.

I think people are way to creative and are too much seeking originality, entertainment and theory. Ross Ennamit once said wrote that Originality is overrated. That is so true.

I believe that suffering boredom for longer periods of time is a metric of a self control.

This is, of course, in line with the Strongfirst WOD... And very much in line with how I approach training for the most part, sticking to plans for long periods of time.

However, I also think that one should feel free to add some spice to it within the principles. Same but different.

For example, following AXE with swings, but rotating the pressing movement every two weeks (alternating, say, low volume Bench Press with higher volume Military Press).

Personally, I have often played around with different (mostly easier!) rep schemes to keep things interesting and to emphasize the quality of practice. For example, doing 20x5 and 14,7 during my S&S period. Or, for example, today I did LCCJ weight ladders instead of my usual 20xCJC with the same weight. I still try to stay true to the program, but every now and then I like to try a "same but different" approach and introduce a heavier weight, or play around with a different technique, etc.

For some it might be as simple as adding some curls and triceps extensions, or having a nonstructured carry day.

That being said, keep the main thing the main thing.

 

[Mo04]

That is a good point. My idea was to use basic StrongFirst programming in a minimalist way, i.e. getting the most out of 3 bells with time-tested programming.

For me, that is a key requirement: getting the most out of my single 16kg, 24kg, and 32kg kettlebells.

What would be best curriculum if all you had were above 3 kettlebells? Don't mind whether the focus is Strength, Endurance, etc - goal is longevity so all good.

Guess even doubles is possible with uneven load (16kg + 24kg)?

 

[Adachi]

Guess even doubles is possible with uneven load (16kg + 24kg)?

a very productive period of time for me was 24kg +32kg front squats and presses.

 

[John K]

best curriculum

Dependent on goals and skills. I know you said you don’t care what for, so someone can pick a goal based on what they like and give you a program for that, but a good program still has an aim.

If longevity is your aim, having 2-3 aerobic locomotive sessions per week, 0-1 anaerobic sessions, and 2-3 weight sessions is pretty well established as being effective. From there, you can pick what you enjoy doing and have fun.

 

[Bauer]

For me, that is a key requirement: getting the most out of my single 16kg, 24kg, and 32kg kettlebells.

What would be best curriculum if all you had were above 3 kettlebells? Don't mind whether the focus is Strength, Endurance, etc - goal is longevity so all good.

Guess even doubles is possible with uneven load (16kg + 24kg)?

I think the first one would be S&S.

After that, there are a few options:
* KBSF with LCCJs
* AXE with the 32 kg + Presses (ROP, Victorious, etc.) or Jerks
* Snatches with Speed Metal (which includes a few plans which are suitable for lighter bells, even if you are able to snatch heavier)
* ROP with C&P and Snatches
* IPM: Snatches and Bent Press

 

[Mo04]

For single kettlebell, are these reasonable goals/plans:

Get to 32kg in the 6 lifts:
1.. Swings (program: S&S)
2.. Get-ups (program: S&S)
3.. Goblet Squat (program: S&S)
4.. Clean (program: ROP)
5.. Press (program: ROP)
6.. Snatch (programs: 24kg snatch test = ROP, then 32kg = Q&D, Iron Cardio)

7.. And, get to 32kg in Carry: Gray Cook Carry Drill (waiter, rack, suitcase)

 

[Bauer]

For single kettlebell, are these reasonable goals/plans:

Get to 32kg in the 6 lifts:
1.. Swings (program: S&S)
2.. Get-ups (program: S&S)
3.. Goblet Squat (program: S&S)
4.. Clean (program: ROP)
5.. Press (program: ROP)
6.. Snatch (programs: 24kg snatch test = ROP, then 32kg = Q&D, Iron Cardio)

7.. And, get to 32kg in Carry: Gray Cook Carry Drill (waiter, rack, suitcase)

I like it. I would merge Clean & Press and add LCCJ earlier on. (I would probably work on preses before that, just not up to 32 kg.)

Get to 32kg in the 6 lifts:
1. Swings (program: S&S)
2. Get-ups (program: S&S)
3. Goblet Squat (program: S&S)
4. LCCJ (program: KBSF)
5. Clean & Press (program: ROP)
6. Snatch (program: Speed Metal, working up to Q&D with 32 kg)

Later goals might include doing Swings and Snatches timed.
1. Timed Simple
2. 5 min. Snatch Test with 32 kg

Honourable variations include:
1. KB Floor Press
2. Bent Press
3. Push Press
4. Iron Cardio: Clean, Press, Front Squat
5. High Pull
6. Cook Carry Drill (overhead, rack, suitcase)

 

[LoneRider]

Knowing what I know presently, here's how I might've commenced my strength journey:

1. Simple and Sinister till Timeless Sinister Standard achieved.
2. Quick and the Dead (either 044, 015, or 033) with short Iron Cardio sessions bolted on to learn the clean/press/squat
3. KB AXE with OR without barbell work of some sort (Rule of 10/PTTP style or Wendler 5/3/1 being candidates...or, if recovery isn't an issue, two Greyskull LP sessions a week).

 

[Simon L]

I like it. I would merge Clean & Press and add LCCJ earlier on. (I would probably work on preses before that, just not up to 32 kg.)

Get to 32kg in the 6 lifts:
1. Swings (program: S&S)
2. Get-ups (program: S&S)
3. Goblet Squat (program: S&S)
4. LCCJ (program: KBSF)
5. Clean & Press (program: ROP)
6. Snatch (program: Speed Metal, working up to Q&D with 32 kg)

Later goals might include doing Swings and Snatches timed.
1. Timed Simple
2. 5 min. Snatch Test with 32 kg

Honourable variations include:
1. KB Floor Press
2. Bent Press
3. Push Press
4. Iron Cardio: Clean, Press, Front Squat
5. High Pull
6. Cook Carry Drill (overhead, rack, suitcase)

My reflections on my own experience is that the below is the basic outline of what I would recommend and coach with a total beginner wanting to become proficient in the 6 main lifts. Proper movement assessment and appropriate restoration and mobility work would be a priority but tailored to the individual. Timescales would be adjusted to the individual in the earlier coaching stages. I like 6 days a week with shorter sessions but this would also be adjusted as needed.

Year 1

Phase 1a 1-4 weeks Hinge and plank

• Coach and practice Naked Hinge, KB deadlift, goblet squat and naked get up with first KB (12-16kg men, 8-12kg women)
• Coach and practice hardstyle plank

Phase 1b 1-4 weeks 2H swing

• Coach and practice 2H swing and loaded getup
• Continue to practice goblet squat, hardstyle plank

Phase 1c 1-4 weeks 1H swing

• Coach and practice 1H deadlift and 1H swing, 1H plank
• Continue to practice, deadlift, 2H swing, goblet squat and hardstyle plank

Phase 2a 10 weeks S&S step 1

• S&S step cycle 1, 4kg jump to 20kg for men 6 days a week

Phase 2b 10 weeks S&S step 2

• S&S Step cycle 2, - 24kg 5 days a week
• Coaching and practice C&P with 16kg
• 1 day a week C&P technique practice and/or GTG style practice 3-4 days

Phase 2c 10 weeks S&S Step 3

• S&S Step Cycle 3 - 28kg 4 days a week
• Coaching and practice Snatch with 16kg
• 1 day a week C&P practice - strength and/or GTG style practice 3-4 days
• 1 day a week Snatch technique practice

Phase 2d 10 weeks S&S Step 4

• S&S Step cycle 4 - 32kg 4 days a week
• 1x a week snatch practice - strength
• 1x a week C&P practice

First year complete basic 6 skills taught, practiced and strength built. Ready to build strength in C&P and snatch.

Phase 3 year 2
For year 2 I see three main options if sticking with kettlebells:
1. S&S 3-4 days a week to work towards timeless solid and timed simple. Option to add variety days to learn and practice double bell cleans and squats or add some C&P programming
2. Focus on building the press running ROP or single bell Giant. Option to add variety days to learn and practice double bell cleans and squats or maintain get ups.
3. Focus on the Snatch building strength and technique then conditioning working towards snatch test. Programming options: KSK, Plan 44

For completeness you would want to work through all three to get to timed simple, 1/2 BW press and snatch test. This could take a year or two depending on various factors. Could run in blocks shifting the focus each time.

Phase 4 Year 3+ Double Bells
Next step would be to learn the double bell lifts and move on to something like Strong. Loads of options here. Built on the solid foundations of above.

 

[John K]

Pavel just posted an article on Navigating the Strong Endurance Universe, for those interested.

How to Navigate the Strong Endurance Universe | StrongFirst

Strong Endurance™ is our umbrella term for all anti-glycolytic training methods.Anti-glycolytic training is “anti-HIIT” that trains you to produce less lactic acid instead of tolerating more of it. AGT is used by many Eastern European national teams in a variety of sports: judo, cross country...

www.strongfirst.com

 

[Tobias Wissmueller]

Very helpful article. Although I read most of Pavels books I am still struggling to put all the pieces together.

What I am missing after reading the article:

- What muscle fibers are trained with Strength Aerobics?

- AXE -> mitochondrial respiration, Q&D -> mitochondrial biogenesis, but what’s with Metal Heart, Strength Aerobics and Super Slow? What mitochondrial effects do they have?

- Q&D is type IIA and IIX fibers, right?

Comparing this with the Strong Endurance section at the end of Q&D where it lists the templates:

- Templates 1-7: AXE
- Templates 8-11: Metal Heart
- Templates 12-13: Strength Aerobics
- Templates 14-16: Q&D
- Templates 17-18: Super Slow 2.0

Is this correct?

Finally, where does Simple and Sinister fit into all this? It doesn’t, because it is too glycolitic to be anti-glycolitic. It’s somewhere between Q&D and HIIT, but outside Strong Endurance. Did I get this right?

 

[Bauer]

- What muscle fibers are trained with Strength Aerobics?

- AXE -> mitochondrial respiration, Q&D -> mitochondrial biogenesis, but what’s with Metal Heart, Strength Aerobics and Super Slow? What mitochondrial effects do they have?

- Q&D is type IIA and IIX fibers, right?

if you haven't already, I think these would be good questions to post as a comment below the article.

Finally, where does Simple and Sinister fit into all this? It doesn’t, because it is too glycolitic to be anti-glycolitic. It’s somewhere between Q&D and HIIT, but outside Strong Endurance. Did I get this right?

I think the timeless aspect still lets it fall under the AXE umbrella. As Al Ciampa said:

S&S swings is alactic work+aerobic recovery “IF” you do not crunch the rest intervals, whether driven by ego or, “it feels easy today”. For the plan to work, you have to stimulate the body for the adaptation you seek.