Barbell Newbie Experience of a Zercher Squat with Unloaded Olympic Bar
- Thread starter Denys Carthusian
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watchnerd
Level 8 Valued Member
Since the bar is unloaded, how are you getting your elbows under it off the floor?
Wouldn't it be too low if it's not on plates?
Or maybe I misunderstood...
"So you don't have to mobility yourself too hard"
That's a pretty good crowd of influencers there.
A Zercher Get-Up!
I agree with the thibarmy article you posted above
Barbell - Newbie Experience of a Zercher Squat with Unloaded Olympic Bar
So, I finally attempted the Zercher - Dan John says in his experience people either love it or hate it. I did it with the 45 lb 7 foot olympic bar so I couldn't possibly bias the results by too much load. My opinion? I don't know whether I will love it when I add it into the training routines...
www.strongfirst.com
“The front squat will do the same“.
Not if you front squat properly!
In a proper front squat (when you keep your torso upright), the barbell remains over the centre of the base of support. In a back squat, it is more toward the rear of the base of support, and in a Zercher squat the bar is more forward; it is toward the front of the base of support, sometimes out of the base of support completely.
So right off the bat, the Zercher puts the bar in a position that drastically increases the demand on the core. Even one inch makes a huge difference in tension.
On top of that, because the bar is held in the crook of your elbows it will tend to try to “pull your torso forward and down”. Preventing that also dramatically increases core contraction.
“Yeah but when I front squat I bend forward, won’t that also increase core activation?”
Those who bend forward in a front squat don’t know how to front squat. The torso angle should remain the same throughout the lift and you should be as upright as your levers allow you to be.
But I get what you are saying.
Yes, to an extent the front squat also increases core activation, although nowhere near the Zercher, you need to have done both at a high level to know it.
And oddly enough, the better technically you are on the front squat, the less important core strength becomes. The more upright you are when you do the front squat, the less the core needs to work. Whereas even if you stay upright in a Zercher, you still get an increase in core contraction intensity because of the position of the bar.
THIS. 100%.
Denys Carthusian
Level 5 Valued Member
Per the SF Barbell series, you simply deadlift the bar onto your thighs (narrow sumo stance). Of course, you do have to have decent hamstring flexibility to pull an Olympic bar off the floor laying flat. The cheat would be to use some type of blocks to raise the bar up for deadlifting into your thighs.
Denys Carthusian
Level 5 Valued Member
Yah, when I felt my core light up I thought "so this is what Neupert has been banging on about all these years."
watchnerd
Level 8 Valued Member
?
Shouldn't be any more flexibility than you'd need to grab a can of beans lying on the floor.
Albeit heavier.
watchnerd
Level 8 Valued Member
Thib seems to be having an internal debate with himself.
I agree with him that front squat, once you become competent to do it right, isn't a great core excercise...
...but is instead a great upper back exercise.
But is the best rationale for Zercher squat as a core exercise?
I'm not debating that it works the core.
Or that it's a primary movement pattern for strongman athletes handling Atlas stones and other odd objects in 'bear hug' type situations.
But if your primary goal is to work the core......why pick a squat at all?
There are a gazillion core exercises out there to choose from.
watchnerd
Level 8 Valued Member
Bromley says the same, that it doesn't have a lot of carry-over unless you're a strongman competitor.
silveraw
Level 9 Valued Member
Both, I mix the “pick”. I’m not zercher deadlifting though like the above video.
I go down till the bar is on my legs and can’t go lower. So a bit below parallel-ish.
I also did zercher good mornings for a bit, those were a bit rough.
Denys Carthusian
Level 5 Valued Member
Dan John said it has a U-shaped acceptance curve amongst trainees. I suspect people's individual anatomical differences are what account for the range of preferences.
Been doing zerchers primarily as my main squat variant for a few months now..
I've done different blocks where I did one off the floor, one from off the pins and no, from the rack
I can't say I have seen a massive transfer yet so to speak but I recently practiced back squats and played with foot position (you need to use a slightly wider stance for ZSQ in my experience) and I have managed to slowly get close to what I could back squat a few years back without the use of a belt and sleeves..
So for what its worth, I think I may be on to something
I've done different blocks where I did one off the floor, one from off the pins and no, from the rack
I can't say I have seen a massive transfer yet so to speak but I recently practiced back squats and played with foot position (you need to use a slightly wider stance for ZSQ in my experience) and I have managed to slowly get close to what I could back squat a few years back without the use of a belt and sleeves..
So for what its worth, I think I may be on to something
Denys Carthusian
Level 5 Valued Member
I was hoping he would start bouncing the bar up in the air off his arms like returning a ball in a volleyball game.
silveraw
Level 9 Valued Member
I recently did an overhead squat PR of 45lbs.Elitist mobility would be preferring overhead squats.
I need to work on shoulder mobility lol
watchnerd
Level 8 Valued Member
Gotta start somewhere!
The bitch about OHSQ is that once you get enough shoulder mobility, the chokepoint just moves someplace else in the chain....
Antti
Level 10 Valued Member
I have to wonder, how much the people who speak of of carryover have actually trained or coached the zercher squat. Still, it is a valid question.
The zercher seems to be a lift you either get or don't. Can't say I've heard of many people change opinions on it.
I like it. I like variety.
The zercher seems to be a lift you either get or don't. Can't say I've heard of many people change opinions on it.
I like it. I like variety.
Same here. Zercher has been my primary squat for the past couple years. Once I get back to it, I want to get back into the weightlifting gym to get some coaching on front squats but in the meantime I feel like zerchers give a lot. It doesn’t take much coaching and I hope to zercher more. I was watching a session with Canadian strongman JF Coran and he said he doesn’t think about it. The deadlift and squat are basic human movements that are always in his training. So I like that. No matter what training I do, those two lifts will always be in my weekly training.