PTTP - your thoughts

Abdul-Rasheed

Level 6 Valued Member
Dear friends,

I have been reading different sections from the PTTP book, and SFL manual (where the PTTP protocol is summarized pretty well in two pages) and various threads on this forum. I am planning to do several short cycles of PTTP alternating with 1-2-3 ladders when appropriate as described in the SFL manual.

Also I I may try different variations (5/3/2, 100%/90%, wave cycles etc) as I move on. I will start with DL and BP (that was a concern I had, to drop SQ). I will start incorporating SQ/MP as some of you have already done with this program later on.

Just to give a background, I am coming out of several months of Faleev's 5x5 program, my first ever barbell program. I could use a change of pace. And some contrast. I am throwing in some cardio component in the form of MAF style jogging, since it is summer and pretty outside.

My goal, being in compliance with Marty Gallagher's advice of doing seasonally appropriate training and nutrition, to lose a few pounds (hopefully fat), to improve my lifting numbers, and to eat clean and light in the next few months of summer. Then in the winter change up the game, eat more and train for hypertrophy (perhaps the russian Bear protocol then).

Do you see any problem with my plan (below)? I hope to run several cycles of this till winter.

Thanks.
 
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ShawnM

Level 8 Valued Member
Usually in PTTP the weights are waved, 2-3 steps forward, 1-2 back. From what your spreadsheet shows you are just adding weight each session, hoping to add 30lbs to your total in three weeks. I think you would be better served adding 5lbs a session for 4-5 sessions say240,245,250,255 the first week. The second week start 245,250,255,260 and so on and so on. I would also drop your starting weight to 225 instead of 240. Better to start light and easy and be bored than stall early on.
 

Steve W.

Level 7 Valued Member
@Abdul Rasheed
I'm only going to comment on the DL numbers since I have a lot of experience with PTTP DL cycles and none with bench.

I'm a big fan of wave cycles. For a realistic 3 week cycle with 4 sessions/week, I'd go with this:

225/235/245/255
235/245/255/265
245/255/265/275

For such a short cycle that ends with a PR, I'd also recommend 100%/90%. You're going to be doing several sessions near or at your 5RM, so I think you will recover better with lighter back off sets.

Better to PR relatively comfortably without maxing than struggle to an absolute max. You will be better set up for sustained progress.
 

wespom9

Level 6 Valued Member
Certified Instructor
I too have done PTTP for my deadlift for a number of different cycles. It's how I initially got to a 2x bw lift, and I just finished a cycle that got it back to that where I will now peak for my own SFL.

I do think it's optimistic to expect your 5RM to jump 30lbs in three weeks. Especially since half your sessions are going to be above your current 5RM. I second both pieces of advice above...wave the cycle and/or start lower. I've had good success doing the 5/3/2 model, as well as the 100/90. I actually prefer the 5/3/2 as the triple and double gave me huge confidence.

As far as the bench...why make an unrealistic option? Better to go low, build momentum. The time spent at the lighter end only assists you later.
 

Abdul-Rasheed

Level 6 Valued Member
Everyone thanks for your inputs.

@ShawnM @Steve W. :
I think the PTTP explained in the SFL manual is slightly different. There it asks one to keep increasing until one fails make 5/2, then take a day off, de-load by 10-15% and go at it again. So it is more of a flexible cycle, right? More like what @Geoff Chafe is saying.

In BP clearly I expect to stall to happen soon. I have no choice by to wave cycle there.

I do think it's optimistic to expect your 5RM to jump 30lbs in three weeks
Per most of your recommendation, I would start at 225lbs and take it easy then.
 

Abdul-Rasheed

Level 6 Valued Member
Updated, training plan. I like this a lot.

upload_2018-6-12_10-39-18.png

Notes:
  • I will switch to 100%/90% along the way if needed
  • I could optionally extend this to a 4-week cycle.
  • DL I am going up by 10lbs; BP by 5lbs.
  • Since wave cycling BP or DL is not expected to stall
  • I will take Wed off; Train Mon, Tue, Thur and Fri
 

Steve W.

Level 7 Valued Member
I think the PTTP explained in the SFL manual is slightly different. There it asks one to keep increasing until one fails make 5/2, then take a day off, de-load by 10-15% and go at it again. So it is more of a flexible cycle, right?
The book has a number of different cycling strategies, with variations on linear, step, and wave cycles. There are lots of ways to cook it.

Since wave cycling BP or DL is not expected to stall
Wave cycling can stall, just like any other cycling strategy. I like it because it gives you a nice rhythm of easier, moderate and challenging sessions, instead of starting with a long run up of easy sessions and then finishing with a death march of near max sessions. It's just using short mini-cycles as building blocks for longer cycles.
 

Abdul-Rasheed

Level 6 Valued Member
Wave cycling can stall, just like any other cycling strategy.
You are right. I said so because the weight increases are not too aggressive/optimistic. My BP for sure is more likely to stall sooner.

Perhaps I should stop at 3 weeks, de-load and start again. We shall see. Any case I am excited about this program now.
 

Abdul-Rasheed

Level 6 Valued Member
Did you progress on it? Did you test a max at the end of it?
This was my first barbell program. I do not have a baseline to compare my ZSQ and BP with. I am lifting more weights than I started. I think that is progress.
As for DL I progressed to a 3RM of 285lbs, that was a few weeks ago. I have not tested further. Should I take a couple of days off and test just the DL?
 

Steve Freides

Staff
Senior Certified Instructor
Elite Certified Instructor
A 3RM is a number you can work with. The last time I saw you, I think that was your 1RM or so, so that's good work on your part. The 1RM calculator says you could pick up 302 for a single, so that's something! It might even be something you want to try, a 300 lb. single.

-S-
 

Abdul-Rasheed

Level 6 Valued Member
Yeah, DL progress was from 265 1RM to 285 3RM, which I am happy about. So my 5RM calculation of 265lb is close and conservative. I am confident I could lift 265lbs for 5 reps. But, I am not sure I could life 300lbs for 1 rep though. I am thinking I will try after couple of these PTTP cycles.

I made some tweaks to my plan. Per SFL manual, one could maintain a lift (in my case Squat) once a week doing either 3/3 or 5/2. So I am thinking of doing that. I will post an update.
 

Matts

Level 3 Valued Member
@Abdul Rasheed Some of the posts above are confusing...looks like 2 different programs were you're first, and you have a lot of analysis, and sound almost pessimistic. They you drop the bomb that you went from MR 265 to 3x285!! That's great progress! You could load the 6 plates and pull it, only thing that seems to be stopping you is your mind at this point. You mention Marty G.- I'll bet he'd tell you just to load the bar and pull like hell! (based on personal experience). Don't overthink it! Be proud of your accomplishments so far- you''re doing very well.
 

Steve Freides

Staff
Senior Certified Instructor
Elite Certified Instructor
For anyone interested, the Surovetsky deadlift program from PTTP Professional is a Russian program but very much influenced by American programming. Thanks to Pavel for pointing this one out to me. I have been training rather freestyle in preparation for an upcoming meet, but it turns out I was doing something very much like this, so much so that I plugged myself into it for yesterday's lifting and it felt perfect.

-S-
 
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