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Kettlebell S&S for the tactical athlete

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tangozero said:
As a "tactical athlete" (SWAT) over the years I've found my ideal balance:

1. A framework of submaximal barbell work, 2 to 3 days a week
2. Kettlebell finishers for strength-endurance, conditioning, and that WTH effect
3. Roughly 80% LISS and 20% HIIT for cardio conditioning

Barbells are my cornerstone for strength. Simply put, no other tool gives me as much bang for my buck for limit-strength. I use a 3 day Tactical barbell template, it suits me perfectly in terms of staying sub-maximal and manageable while improving strength significantly on a long term basis.
I keep the kettlebell work simple...5-10 x 10 swings as a finisher 2-3 x a week, immediately after a weight workout. More or less depending on how I feel and if I have anything strenuous on my plate for the week. Kettlebells are a staple in my conditioning work too, when I do HIIT style training. Sprints or hill sprints mixed with swings or snatches add an entirely new dimension to cardio and overall conditioning. The bells take care of my grip, I find I don't need any extra/specialized grip work.

One or two 6-8 week aerobic base building blocks a year. Maff-style running along with bodyweight/calisthenics and kettlebell circuits...no barbells. As a matter of fact, this year I'll be doing Base with S&S + Pull-ups.
After Base, a regular week of cardio for me looks like 2-3 Maff runs or 2 Maff runs and 1 HIIT.

I don't really have to change my training much come PFT. I use weighted-pull-ups in my strength work, and my cardio is taken care of year round. Those are the two toughest bench marks in our unit as far as PFT is concerned (total pull-ups, 1.5 and 6 mile). Push-ups stay relatively constant year round with very little training, so as PFT approaches I might add in a few sets every week or not.

By far my biggest lesson over the years has been to stay submaximal and consistent. I'm not sure who said it, but "stimulate, don't annihilate". That being said, it's a fine balance staying submaximal but still doing enough to improve. I fell into both traps; going too hard, balls-to-the-wall and a little too "submaximal". The hardcore approach just isn't sustainable for me long term...I can see it's use for selection prep or something similar though. Going "too submaximal" felt good, but honestly as a "tactical athlete" my times and fitness markers suffered. As always, it seems the answer is somewhere in the middle.
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I do the same thing with 6-8 week aerobic base building when I know I've got an APFT coming up. It works really well with terrain other than pavement when you're trying to get into pavement testing shape. Best thing I ever did was start approaching it like that. Unfortunately in the Army everyone only knows what YouTube tells them so they all think balls to the wall and 5-8 miles four times a week is the only way to progress.

Lee Haney for the quote.

Mac
 
A little late to the party here. Personally I feel that s&s can be a solid base for the tactical athlete. I've ran a tactical barbell template in the past and still utilize it somewhat now. Unforunately I no longer have access to a squat rack and train at home. I have a wide array of kettlebells, a pullup bar and 500lb barbell set. At least twice a year I run s&s with heavy Goblet squats and FPP added in. Occasionally I swap out swings for deadlifts. I feel this covers all the movement patterns of the body perfectly. From the spring till fall I'll hit this 3 times a week with 3 lsd sessions. Though my max strength isn't where it was I feel more functional. Personally I feel that functional strength is the base of the tactical athlete. I have guys on my team that can press and squat the earth. The problem came when it was time to move under load during a long k-9 track. They just burnt out. With s&s as the base of my training I feel more well rounded. S&S is extremely flexible too. Its a solid program that leaves me fresh so the next day can be a solid run or ruck. After rambling I think it's time to switch back to it! Thanks everyone. Stay strong my friends.
 
Reading this thread got me thinking that training for the "tactical athlete" is also well suited for all of us weekend warriors without specific training goals.

I've seen many times that when a guy asks for advice we ask "what are your goals?". Many times, the answer is just "well, I don't know, I'd like to be stronger, lose some fat, you know, get fit, feel better". This answer is so broad that almost any reasonable suggestion would fit. I certainly fall in this category: I practice a variety of sports at amateur level, from kiteboarding to soccer, mountain bike, you name it. I just want something that helps me with all that in a general manner, and in particular to assist keeping injuries away.

I sometimes set arbitrary goals that apparently aim in helping all (or most) physical activities I do: reaching 2x bw deadlift, being able to rest in the squat position , do a pistol, reaching S&S simple, 12-15% body fat, etc. But the truth is, I just want to be in good shape, these goals are an arbitrary way of trying to measure my progress in that direction.

I think this is why Pavel talks so much about military preparation in his books (many of which addressed to a general audience). But I don't recall reading him say it black over white.

My conclusion is just that: if you don't know what to train for, train like a soldier.

Sorry for the rant in the middle of this thread.
 
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Oscar said:
Reading this thread got me thinking that training for the "tactical athlete" is also well suited for all of us weekend warriors without specific training goals.

My conclusion is just that: if you don't know what to train for, train like a soldier.
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Great conclusion, yet something to consider, we all train for specific events, that do not always cross over to actual fitness....
 
Wandering Norseman said:
Crucial statement here. In a true tactical athlete (Not a logistics, or supply, or admin guy sitting in garrison) the ability to still do the job later today, and again tomorrow is vital.
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To @Oscar conclusion, I think this really applies to the strength/fitness generalist too. Granted, most of us don't have jobs as physically demanding as true tactical athletes, but if your training leaves you wiped out for the rest of the day, you're basically missing out on real life.

Pavel and StrongFirst have broken me of the idea that workouts should tear you down, and it fits real life. I can get stronger, and still do my chores and play with the kids. Tactical dad.
 
Good insight here. At first I was turned off by the "tactical athlete" trend, thinking it was just wannabe commandos doing silly stuff. Or, that it was very job specific and therefore not applicable to most. But as I read more, it made a lot sense for regular people, just like Oscar explained. Getting stronger and staying fresh in a time efficient manner makes a lot of sense for people who want to be active doing a variety of activities, athletic or otherwise and not feel beat up all the time. No offense toward bodybuilding or competitive weight lifting, but for those of us for whom the gym is not our sport, tactical programs may be a good fit.
 
Wandering Norseman said:
Great conclusion, yet something to consider, we all train for specific events, that do not always cross over to actual fitness....
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Yes, I was thinking about this too. What I mean is to train like @Timothy Friel, @tangozero and others described in the previous posts, that seems to be the kind of training to get you ready for military duties. I wasn't talking about those specific events.
 
@Timothy Friel, your post above (#43 in this thread) would make a great review of S&S on amazon.com - please post a review there if you haven't already.

Thanks very much.

-S-
 
WhatWouldHulkDo said:
Pavel and StrongFirst have broken me of the idea that workouts should tear you down, and it fits real life. I can get stronger, and still do my chores and play with the kids. Tactical dad.
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Yes! This is beyond perfect. It's like my fitness goals and methodology all tied up in one. I might add it to my signature.

#tacticaldad
 
Marc said:
This one is a bit off topic but it came to my mind: you might check out "Original Strength For The Tactical Athlethe"
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I’ve read the kindle sample but can’t get a feel for what’s in the rest of the book. Is it a complete “program” or is it resets with a “tactical” bias? Any other insight is appreciated.
 
A topic near and dear to my heart, as I'm on the tail end of 'tactical' but trying to hang on for a few years and keep up with the younger guys. :)

A couple of thoughts -

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I believe S&S makes an excellent military deployment workout, with a few simple additions (pullups, perhaps). I've not done a program that gave me gains and still left me feeling like I was fresh enough to go on an extended patrol at a moment's notice. I did a Crossfit workout in Afghanistan that left my back wrenched. That was the last time I did deadlifts for time. I remember laying in my cot hoping we didn't leave the FOB for a few days because I was in no condition to do anything. Even if I hadn't pulled my back, I would have been too smoked to be 100% for the next few days.

However, I don't think S&S is enough to prepare for a military selection. You are going to have to be more 'sport specific' with the 'sport' being the events of the selection.

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I think it helps to set some objective standards and goals, but this is not without pitfalls*.

Rippetoe has a decent set of military minimum standards that could also apply to LEOs
  1. Double bodyweight deadlift.
  2. Standing Overhead Press with 75% of bodyweight on the bar.
  3. Chin-ups-12 minimum
  4. 400 meters in 75 seconds or less.
Of course, Rip being Rip, he totally neglects long distance runs and rucks. But I think it's decent and can be attained by anyone with some time and effort. The standards aren't so high that you have to turn into a powerlifter to meet them.

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I think it's good to make a distinction between urban LEOs and the military. For example, Tactical Barbell's conditioning book has 'green' and 'black' programs. Green being for military that needs long range movement capabilities and Black for LEOs that are not likely to patrol for days at a time or have long infils.


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*So, Rips standards revolve mostly around a barbell. I discovered KBs relatively recently and I'm a sample of one. But I feel good when I work with kettlebells. My recent work with barbells has been a series of nagging to serious injuries, which may or may not have been related to using a barbell at 90% of my 1RM.

Everyone knows about the WTH effect, and I'm convinced there's something intrinsic with KBs that you won't appreciate if your standards revolve around the barbell. Eric Frohardt talked in a podcast about moving better when he switch to strictly KB work, and he had no drop off in PT scores from when he trained more specifically for the PT tests (or something like that). I'd probably hedge at this point and add deadlifts and pullups. If I'm being honest, there's probably no reason other than ego for me to bench press (aesthetics and to be able to answer "how much ya bench?" are not good reasons.)
 
Tirofijo said:
I’ve read the kindle sample but can’t get a feel for what’s in the rest of the book. Is it a complete “program” or is it resets with a “tactical” bias? Any other insight is appreciated.
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It does contain a programme, as far as I remember
 
Rip isn't suggesting what he thinks will help you best meet the required standards and current physical culture of the armed forces, he's suggesting what he feels would be most useful for carry over to deployment duties. So I'm sure he would suggest long slow distance and rucks to meet the expectations and requirements, he just thinks that the tasks soldiers are required to do on the field are better served by strength and explosiveness than long endurance.
I watched a video of him interviewing Marty Gallagher and they both felt that it would be good for military personnel to have 2.5xDL, 2x bodyweight squat, and 1.5x bodyweight bench press (if I'm not mistaken, Dan John also suggests those as the point of diminishing returns for most athletes in general in Easy Strength).
Also, Rip agreed with Marty that you would want bodyweight between 185 and 215 pounds for most men in that situation.

My own experience with barbells (at age 28) has been that I feel more mobile and resilient than ever. I had trained only S&S, and really enjoyed that and got a lot out of it. However, I've been much more "bullet proof", less achy, and more mobile/flexible than ever since working Faleev's 5x5 program. Does it come down to technique issues? Range of motion used? Lack of mobility work with bad postural habits?
 
jca17 said:
Rip isn't suggesting what he thinks will help you best meet the required standards and current physical culture of the armed forces, he's suggesting what he feels would be most useful for carry over to deployment duties. So I'm sure he would suggest long slow distance and rucks to meet the expectations and requirements, he just thinks that the tasks soldiers are required to do on the field are better served by strength and explosiveness than long endurance.
I watched a video of him interviewing Marty Gallagher and they both felt that it would be good for military personnel to have 2.5xDL, 2x bodyweight squat, and 1.5x bodyweight bench press (if I'm not mistaken, Dan John also suggests those as the point of diminishing returns for most athletes in general in Easy Strength).
Also, Rip agreed with Marty that you would want bodyweight between 185 and 215 pounds for most men in that situation.
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Those were Rip’s minimum PT standards. If he had wanted to include a run or ruck he could have. He even says "Everybody tells me that running is not terribly applicable to a combat situation, but as a result of the military’s endurance focus things are not being done to make training as effective as it could be."

I'm not sure he would suggest long slow distance.

Here's the article I took that from.

Are you Strong Enough? An interview with Mark Rippetoe

Regarding the Marty Gallagher and Rippetoe discussion:

In that video, which is discussing SOF troops which are going to have a higher standard than most units, Gallagher and Rip are mostly in agreement, but Rip wanted a 5'11'' guy to be at least 185 while Gallagher said 175 would work as they have to carry that extra mass in the infil. Rip seems skeptical. Martly talks about an operator that's too muscled up and can't move (ie ruck). Marty gets that at some point mass will be counterproductive but I don't know that Rip does and I don't think Rip appreciates that there is a huge endurance component to SOF and the infantry.

RIP seemed to think everyone jumps off the bird, sprints 40 yards and then starts low bar back squatting. (I’m being facetious, of course. :))

Here's the video. The discussion of SOF strength requirements starts around the 35 minute mark.





In the video he kinda rails on "5 mile run endurance" but I can tell you there is a correlation between a 5 mile run and ruck marching. Factor in bodyweight (which gives you a very, very rough idea of a soldier's strength) and the correlation gets stronger. The 5'11'' 185lb guy that maxes his 2 mile rule is going to be pretty good with a rucksack. The wispy 135lber that runs the 2 mile in the same time is usually going have a harder go of it when rucking, as the rucksack will weigh the same for both and isn't scaled down to account for bodyweight.

So don't get me wrong. By no means am I advocating big Army's classic formation run on Mon-Wed-Friday with everyone running the same speed and pushups and mountain climbers on Tues and Thursday, but you can't throw the baby out with the bath water.


Anyway, trying to guess what Rip does or doesn't think about military endurance requirements isn't relevant. I have my first hand experience. While I think he's wrong about endurance needs, I do like his (minimum) PT standards that I quoted in my first post.
 
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jca17 said:
My own experience with barbells (at age 28) has been that I feel more mobile and resilient than ever. I had trained only S&S, and really enjoyed that and got a lot out of it. However, I've been much more "bullet proof", less achy, and more mobile/flexible than ever since working Faleev's 5x5 program. Does it come down to technique issues? Range of motion used? Lack of mobility work with bad postural habits?
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I like to believe my technique is decent and I use full range of motion. I certainly could have done more mobility work. Definitely a problem there and room to improve. Looking back, some TGUs as a warm up before the barbell would have been a good idea.

Might also have to do with the difference between being 28 and 45. I don't expect my experience to match up with everyone else.
 
For sure. I do a lot of Relax into Stretch style stretching, generating isometric tension at both maximally contacted and lengthened positions. I really don't know what barbell only would do for me, but barbell plus mobility work has done wonders. It's like the heavy lifting hits "save" on the mobility work that I do in a way that lighter loads didn't.
 
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