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Kettlebell Going Goblet Heavy

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Heavy goblet squats are great. :) That and kettlebell overhead squats are my primary squatting exercises. I also like to hold in the bottom of the kettlebell squat and curl the bell. One of my go to sessions when I am short on time is the Descending/Ascending Goblet Squat/Goblet Curl session.
 
Gary Music said:
Heavy goblet squats are great. :) That and kettlebell overhead squats are my primary squatting exercises. I also like to hold in the bottom of the kettlebell squat and curl the bell. One of my go to sessions when I am short on time is the Descending/Ascending Goblet Squat/Goblet Curl session.
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Will try the curls soon
 
Hello,

Other variations : deck squats and cradle squats. However, these variations are likely to be done relatively light.

Kind regards,

Pet'
 
I must say that I'm skeptical about the goblet squat leading to substantial improvements in the barbell squat. It's a great warm up drill and for someone who has never done a squat with the weight in front it will likely help strengthen the abs which may result in some improvement in the squat. It's also an interesting way to do high rep squats for strength-endurance. But I seriously doubt that 48 kg goblet squats will lead to a 315 squat without other training.
 
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Hello,

MikeTheBear said:
I seriously doubt that 48 kg goblet squats will lead to a 315 squat with other training
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I do not have a very precise opinion actually.

I know that kb have huge WTH effect. For instance, @Pavel Macek's deadlifts weights without specific deadlift program. From my humble experience, I only do heavy swings and some weighted pistol (PR @ only 28) and I can DL 2X bdw.

Related to the squat, maybe it is possible do the relatively significant training volume (one day @48kg x 5 x 5 and one @32kg x 8-10 x 10). Plus, we do not know too much about the rest of the routine. I guess you suppose he did some other strength moves such as GU or even standard squat ?

Kind regards,

Pet'
 
I meant to write "I seriously doubt that 48 kg goblet squats will lead to a 315 squat WITHOUT other training." Yes I think whoever got to 315 on the squat most likely did some heavy squats in addition to the goblet squats. I would also like to know how much this person squatted before starting on goblet squats.

Ballistics behave a bit differently and there's been lots of anecdotal evidence that just doing swings can lead to improvements in the deadlift.

I would really like for the squat story to be true. Nothing better than getting a strength increase from relatively light training. I have no doubt that goblet squats can help someone break a plateau because holding the kb in front can help strengthen the abs and upper back. But I have my doubts.
 
I confess I find quite a bit to find fault with in that video. My biggest complaint is that even a Beast goblet squat is still a Barbie weight when it comes to squatting, so why not reap the benefits of squatting and pause at the bottom? If the weight is light, take steps to make it heavier by focus on your mobility to get into the best bottom position possible, and then learn to repressurize and come back up strong. Or just pause for 1-second then come back up.

He doesn't straighten the knee of the "straight" leg in his Cossacks.

He doesn't have the overhead mobility for the OHS on his right side.

If you want to squat with kettlebells and some weight, do two-bell front squats. Those can be good ab exercise, not altogether dissimilar from a zercher squat in some ways.

-S-
 
Gary Music said:
Yorkshire when you do these make sure you maintain your braced proper goblet squat position while you curl. The tendency is to collapse between the knees when starting the curl, do not less this happen stay braced and in proper squat position and you will love them.
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Thanks, will do. Think I will work up from very light to get a feel for it
 
David S said:
@MikeTheBear this thread from a while back sheds a bit of light on the goblet carryover to back squats
Question for Mark Toomey about Goblet Squat routine from Easy Strength
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Thanks @David S. The text in easy strength is a bit misleading. Mr Toomey was training with heavy back squats before and during but through the goblet squats he was able to squat better that is more efficiently and staying healthy.
As @MikeTheBear I had some doubts about the carry over. Switching from a fairly heavy goblet squat to a moderately heavy barbell means often a difference of 50 - 70 kg or more for stronger guys. I think kettlebell exercises can be very valuable to fix holes such as in Mr Toomey's case. This way one can overcome a plateau, but it might not be sufficient to build the raw strength.

The deadlift seems to be another case. Since it is such a basic move many ways lead to fairly impressive deadlift numbers.
Gireviks often report deadlifts between 180 and 220 kg from training with two 32s.
I guess a combination of the ballistic load and the repeated effort.
 
Hello,

I think @Marlon Leon underlines a significant point here.

Swings are a ballistic move and we notice a "transfer" from a ballistic to a grind. Physics and dynamics are very different in these moves.

Here, it we talk about the transfer from a grind to another grind, but one is done with a relatively light weight. Plus, these are the same grinds : squat / squat. So, dynamics, physics and biomechanics are the same here. The only difference is the training volume.

Instinctively, I would see a better transfer from swings to bb squat. From kb squat to bb squat, I would consider for instance that a very slow kb squat in a full ROM would have a better transfer to standard bb squat.

Kind regards,

Pet'
 
Fair to say also that the heavier the goblet squat becomes the more danger in injuring the upper back due to position of weight, probably more forward than you'd like even though it acts as a counterweight? And, even though you may be able to keep a safer alignment? The heavier the bell, the bigger it is, the more the mass moves forward?
 
+1 @Marlon Leon - without training with a heavy barbell on your back the WTH effect of goblets is not going to transfer - there's just a big difference between holding the Beast and doing sets of 5s in goblet fashion and standing beneath a heavy barbell, getting it to sit comfortably on your back, then dropping between your legs and getting back up - without the specific heavy barbell training i don't think you can make the leap between the two lifts. In Toomey's case the goblet squat acts as "a break" in training, so the body can get a bit of relief from heavy squatting without detracting too much from progress. Also recognize as @Steve Freides pointed out, that in the world of squatting, the Beast is a Barbie weight, and so, I might add, is 315. To squat heavy, well, you simply need to squat heavy.
 
only got back into kettlebells last year or so, before that was powerlifting. of late have done 80kg front squats with the kettlebell - one 48kg and one 32kg, hugely challenging and could see how it would assist in working some muscles which would help with the squats.

having said that I've done 220kg x 5 in a low bar squat and those front squats with KB wouldn't have prepped me for the shear forces that amount of weight across your back feels like. Maybe I'm wrong but specifity of load is important I feel.

I have seen a few SFG guys of late doing 92kg KB swings in instagram - hugely impressive but there deadlifts are "only" 180-200kg. Once you get over a certain weight lighter weights accelerated don't cut it I feel
 
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