Kettlebell Simple & Sinister = Pressing Strength?
- Thread starter NormanOsborn
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AndyMcL
Level 5 Valued Member
Out of curiosity why do you prefer those over dips?
watchnerd
Level 8 Valued Member
Horizontal plane of motion.
I already do a lot of overhead pressing / jerking / snatching, so I don't want another "vertical press" in the form of the dip.
Also, I don't have EMG studies to back it up, but I feel like the serratus anterior action and scapular protraction is stronger.
Lastly, the ring element provides a more 3D stabilization challenge than dips on bars do (although not the case for ring dips).
AndyMcL
Level 5 Valued Member
Don't know if I've ever felt something torch the stabilizing muscles like ring dips.
Molson
Level 5 Valued Member
Westside have an interesting stabilizing muscle bench variation. It’s an accessory lift. They hang a few small kettlebells on rubber bands on the barbell and bench it.
watchnerd
Level 8 Valued Member
It's up there.
But, again..it's a "vertical press", and I prefer not to do more of the same plane of motion if I'm doing overhead pressing / BB snatches / BB jerks,
pet'
Level 8 Valued Member
Hello,
As @watchnerd said, if one already has a lot of OVH work in other activities, I think dips and other vertical pushes are not necessary or even wanted.
However, when it comes to choose one or the other (kind of desert island choice), most of the time, the vertical push transfer better to the horizontal than the other way around due to stabilization work.
A trick could be to do instable horizontal push (using TRX, or a band fixed on the sides, etc...)
That being said this is a matter of goal.
For instance if you work on several angles (from vertical (hspu) to horizontal (push up) and some lateral (archer)) one should not have trouble to perform a Get Up.
Kind regards,
Pet'
As @watchnerd said, if one already has a lot of OVH work in other activities, I think dips and other vertical pushes are not necessary or even wanted.
However, when it comes to choose one or the other (kind of desert island choice), most of the time, the vertical push transfer better to the horizontal than the other way around due to stabilization work.
A trick could be to do instable horizontal push (using TRX, or a band fixed on the sides, etc...)
That being said this is a matter of goal.
For instance if you work on several angles (from vertical (hspu) to horizontal (push up) and some lateral (archer)) one should not have trouble to perform a Get Up.
Kind regards,
Pet'
AndyMcL
Level 5 Valued Member
Thats interesting. I've always considered dips to be sort of an "in between press". Sort of in-between vertical and horizontal (incline press would fit in here too).
Some stray pressing observations (based on my experience, not referencing EMG studies):
-OH Press: hits shoulders really well, triceps fairly well, and minimal chest engagement
-Dips: Hits triceps really well, chest pretty well, and shoulders minimally (rings helps with that)
-Incline Press: Hits chest really well, shoulders pretty well, don't feel it a ton in triceps
-Flat Bench: hits all three fairly well
-Push Ups: similar to bench, but more complicated to develop progressions for. Great for scapula.
Feel core the most for OH and push ups.
I find that overhead work does very little for my bench. My sticking point is fairly close to my chest and don't get a lot of help for that with pressing overhead. Additionally, it seems like flat pressing overloads the triceps more.
However, I get a ton of carryover from bench to overhead. I've hit my OH PR twice, once following a high volume of pressing and another time with low volume of press and medium volume of bench.
Some stray pressing observations (based on my experience, not referencing EMG studies):
-OH Press: hits shoulders really well, triceps fairly well, and minimal chest engagement
-Dips: Hits triceps really well, chest pretty well, and shoulders minimally (rings helps with that)
-Incline Press: Hits chest really well, shoulders pretty well, don't feel it a ton in triceps
-Flat Bench: hits all three fairly well
-Push Ups: similar to bench, but more complicated to develop progressions for. Great for scapula.
Feel core the most for OH and push ups.
I find that overhead work does very little for my bench. My sticking point is fairly close to my chest and don't get a lot of help for that with pressing overhead. Additionally, it seems like flat pressing overloads the triceps more.
However, I get a ton of carryover from bench to overhead. I've hit my OH PR twice, once following a high volume of pressing and another time with low volume of press and medium volume of bench.
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pet'
Level 8 Valued Member
Hello,
Here is something interesting regarding the press topic:
Kind regards,
Pet'
Here is something interesting regarding the press topic:
The Best Press Exercise | StrongFirst
Which press gets you the strongest while avoiding injury? Let's look at the possibilities and I'll explain the reasons for my choice of best press exercise
www.strongfirst.com
Kind regards,
Pet'
NormanOsborn
Level 5 Valued Member
Hello,
Here is something interesting regarding the press topic:
The Best Press Exercise | StrongFirst
Which press gets you the strongest while avoiding injury? Let's look at the possibilities and I'll explain the reasons for my choice of best press exercisewww.strongfirst.com
Kind regards,
Pet'
Yeah, that was the article I was referencing when I said Pavel himself regarded Bench as the best pressing exercise.
Great thread here.
IMHO, “The swing is the thing.” If you’re going to do a single exercise, make it the kettlebell swing.
If I had to pick one way to adding pressing to S&S, it would be to add one or more presses inside of the getup.
-S-
IMHO, “The swing is the thing.” If you’re going to do a single exercise, make it the kettlebell swing.
If I had to pick one way to adding pressing to S&S, it would be to add one or more presses inside of the getup.
-S-
pet'
Level 8 Valued Member
Hello,
I agree with @Steve Freides and this is a strategy Dan John also mentions. In a podcast, not that long ago, he said that doing a press at each step of the GU would make a 24kg bell quite heavy. If I remember well, there was 6 or 7 presses per GU. So if you go for the classic 5 GU per session, you end up with a decent pressing volume.
Assuming 6 presses per GU, 5 GU, 6 times per week: this is 180 presses a week
Kind regards,
Pet'
I agree with @Steve Freides and this is a strategy Dan John also mentions. In a podcast, not that long ago, he said that doing a press at each step of the GU would make a 24kg bell quite heavy. If I remember well, there was 6 or 7 presses per GU. So if you go for the classic 5 GU per session, you end up with a decent pressing volume.
Assuming 6 presses per GU, 5 GU, 6 times per week: this is 180 presses a week
Kind regards,
Pet'
It works, and in many ways.
Six presses a side. Some will skip the press which resembles a bent press after the first leg sweep, so five a side in that case.
From my notes, 8:22a Feb. 18, 20 GU's, 6 presses a side with 16kg, 11:51. A 24kg would be some work.
pet'
Level 8 Valued Member
No, was having some shoulder/bicep issues so I used the light GU+Presses for rehab and to maintain some fitness.
AndyMcL
Level 5 Valued Member
Out of curiosity, what makes you pick swing over snatch?
patterner
Level 5 Valued Member
I think Pavel's point here (and broadly, with including the bench in any program) is that the bench allows you to load the upper body much more than a standing press.
That said, I think the vertical presses have a lot more carryover to other activities, but bench gains lead to press gains.
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