ChiBill
Level 6 Valued Member
Also getting the same number of sets done in less time is progress. If you do 9 sets this week but finished in less time than you did 9 sets the week before it's a good thing, even if there's not enough time for set 10.
Other/Mixed EASY MUSCLE (Geoff Neupert)
- Thread starter Xene
- Start date
Other strength modalities (e.g., Clubs), mixed strength modalities (e.g., combined kettlebell and barbell), other goals (flexibility)
jmoran01
Level 5 Valued Member
Okay on my last week of EM schedule A with 2x16s. For next week was planning on starting schedule B with either one 18 kg (probably my double 5RM) or could use 2x20s and push press them if I can’t get strict reps. I only have one 18 bell unfortunately. Which do you think is better?
Pete L
Level 6 Valued Member
Personally, I'd double up and push press. Nice variety and cleans will be worth the effort.
jmoran01
Level 5 Valued Member
Realizing that I have weeks 5-8 coming up for schedule A. Will stay on this program though even with 2x16s I had to push press the last 1-2 reps at the end of the last three rounds today. I did 10 sets and was trying a high RPE because it’s week 4. And I played an intense softball game last night so was tired. It was probably related to generalized fatigue.
After week 8, my plan is to test my max with 2x20s, my single 18 kg, and 2x16s.
GreenSoup
Level 6 Valued Member
Congrats on the awesome results JNort. I agree that C+P can be addicting after a while.
GreenSoup
Level 6 Valued Member
Easy Muscle results and review. Hopefully you can troubleshoot my questions @Geoff Neupert and others.
I completed my first run through of Easy Muscle with a 16kg and a 12kg as uneven doubles, alternating each side. My starting reps were 10 with the heavier KB on the left side.
This was half a year after my return from a shoulder injury while I mostly trained my legs for a while and only did comfortable arm moves, which meant I could do double cleans with my two heaviest kettlebells, the 32kg+24kg. Perhaps the recovering arm strength combined with improved leg strength explains the results.
I purchased Easy Muscle because I got the promised recomposition results from Dry Fighting Weight and figured a longer program would be better. Easy Muscle's sales page promised big results even with guys who had messed up sleep and every recovery factor against them. I didn't know it at the time but I would become one of those guys. Life put me through the wringer. Was my recovery and stress more physiologically powerful than theirs? I pushed some workout days off the M-W-F schedule because an extra 30 minutes of sleep was the more responsible thing to do on some days. By the end of twelve weeks I caught up to M-W-F after treating weekends as one day off instead of two.
I went from 10 reps to 16 military press reps with the 16/12 and my push press reps on my next heaviest kettlebell, the 24kg, went from 3 to 5. So the strength gain was there. Fat loss and muscle gain results were not. The scale and the waist measurements (along with my general appearance) did not change.
What happened to the recomposition the program promised?
Some weeks were at maintenance but others had me eating had fewer calories than usual and I always made sure to get 0.8+ grams of protein per pound of body weight. The Easy Muscle book just recommends "eat less" for dieting, and says the workouts alone can do the magic.
In training, was I beyond the task of cleaning press weights that would contribute to fat loss? I never ran into the guardrails. I believe I could have been comfortable snatch-pressing insead of using the clean and press for all of Schedule A due to training legs for a year during my injury.
Even for presses they never met the guardrails, but there were times when my shoulders were on fire and I just thought "punch it up!" as if trying to press explosively but fatigue made it the same speed as a regular press. Should that have been "a stop the set" moment? I DID run into moments when I just felt I couldn't punch it and ended the set there, but if I have to punch it up does that really mean I should stop the set to preserve fast twitch activation? Or would that have even made a difference on muscle gain?
Even without the fat loss or muscle gain I found the program enjoyable and it was my peace when life became messed up for a while. I would like to see how I can improve my next run through Easy Muscle.
I completed my first run through of Easy Muscle with a 16kg and a 12kg as uneven doubles, alternating each side. My starting reps were 10 with the heavier KB on the left side.
This was half a year after my return from a shoulder injury while I mostly trained my legs for a while and only did comfortable arm moves, which meant I could do double cleans with my two heaviest kettlebells, the 32kg+24kg. Perhaps the recovering arm strength combined with improved leg strength explains the results.
I purchased Easy Muscle because I got the promised recomposition results from Dry Fighting Weight and figured a longer program would be better. Easy Muscle's sales page promised big results even with guys who had messed up sleep and every recovery factor against them. I didn't know it at the time but I would become one of those guys. Life put me through the wringer. Was my recovery and stress more physiologically powerful than theirs? I pushed some workout days off the M-W-F schedule because an extra 30 minutes of sleep was the more responsible thing to do on some days. By the end of twelve weeks I caught up to M-W-F after treating weekends as one day off instead of two.
I went from 10 reps to 16 military press reps with the 16/12 and my push press reps on my next heaviest kettlebell, the 24kg, went from 3 to 5. So the strength gain was there. Fat loss and muscle gain results were not. The scale and the waist measurements (along with my general appearance) did not change.
What happened to the recomposition the program promised?
Some weeks were at maintenance but others had me eating had fewer calories than usual and I always made sure to get 0.8+ grams of protein per pound of body weight. The Easy Muscle book just recommends "eat less" for dieting, and says the workouts alone can do the magic.
In training, was I beyond the task of cleaning press weights that would contribute to fat loss? I never ran into the guardrails. I believe I could have been comfortable snatch-pressing insead of using the clean and press for all of Schedule A due to training legs for a year during my injury.
Even for presses they never met the guardrails, but there were times when my shoulders were on fire and I just thought "punch it up!" as if trying to press explosively but fatigue made it the same speed as a regular press. Should that have been "a stop the set" moment? I DID run into moments when I just felt I couldn't punch it and ended the set there, but if I have to punch it up does that really mean I should stop the set to preserve fast twitch activation? Or would that have even made a difference on muscle gain?
Even without the fat loss or muscle gain I found the program enjoyable and it was my peace when life became messed up for a while. I would like to see how I can improve my next run through Easy Muscle.
Ben Strong
Level 5 Valued Member
Congrats on completing the program!
FWIW, it sounds to me like you did experience some recomposition. You state that the scale and waist measurements did not move yet your strength increased. That amount of strength gain likely involved some increase in muscle tissue which means you would have decreased fat to offset any gain in muscle weight. To me that sounds like an accomplishment you should be proud of under the circumstances (stress, lack of sleep etc)
Also based on your post it sounds like you had a stressful time while running this program. The stress and lack of sleep can make fat loss really quite difficult. Overall it sounds like you are on the right track. Since you enjoyed running the program I would suggest giving it another go and try to reduce stress as much as possible and dedicate as much time to sleeping as you can and see what happens.
Another option, if you want to ramp up fat loss, would be to add in some additional walking. When I am trying to lose fat I like to up my daily step count by about 2,000 steps above my normal average. Say normally I hit 8,000 steps daily. I would then try to get 10,000 steps during a fat loss phase. Doesn't have to be from a single walk either. Could just be increased activity moving around the house. This is just what works for me but give it a shot if you want.
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flightposite
Level 6 Valued Member
I have probably a silly question also concerning the RPE.
If during a session you seem to reach a point where the guardrails are not being met because of technical breakdown or speed of lift comes grinding down. Do you lower the weight in order to stay with the desired RPE and keep on hitting your sets until the timer expires or do you just stop the whole session?
If during a session you seem to reach a point where the guardrails are not being met because of technical breakdown or speed of lift comes grinding down. Do you lower the weight in order to stay with the desired RPE and keep on hitting your sets until the timer expires or do you just stop the whole session?
justinr
Level 5 Valued Member
First try a longer rest if the session allows it (3 or 4 minutes). If after longer rest, you're still having technical breakdown, end the session.
flightposite
Level 6 Valued Member
Thank you for the much needed clarification.
So just to make sure I am understanding. The weights always remain constant throughout the program. Am I understanding that correctly?
Pete L
Level 6 Valued Member
Yes.
justinr
Level 5 Valued Member
So if the weight was chosen correctly, yes. It should remain constant. But if you're struggling with your 1st set on your 1st day of your 1st week, the weight is too heavy, and you should go down.
flightposite
Level 6 Valued Member
No they are roughly my 5 and 10rm respectively. I got that part correct. I think where I am kinda messing up is in estimating my RPE. Especially the first week. A 7 is kinda foreign to me lol. But I guess I just need to pay better attention to the guardrails. I feel like I probably already went to an 8.5 or 9 in terms of effort level.
But I’m sure it will start to autocorrect if I follow the stop signs.
Thanks for the help everyone
Pete L
Level 6 Valued Member
I struggled at first. For me it was about thinking about the sets ahead and not just the next set.
Just start medium and build up. That's the point of the RPE.
GreenSoup
Level 6 Valued Member
Thank you for the suggestions Ben. A few weeks before I move into the EM phase I'll do a program that can be spread across the day for added flexibility. Stress and lack of sleep have a way of making everything more difficult so it requires even sharper planning than usual.
@GreenSoup,
Thanks for your review. Please scroll down for my thoughts.
Let me know if this helps and if this makes sense.
Thanks for your review. Please scroll down for my thoughts.
After reading your post several times, I think this is probably most of the issue here. While the presses may have been challenging for your shoulders, post injury, as we would expect, it just wasn't enough of a stimulus to demand much adaptation from you body/system as a whole.
Possibly. It's hard to compare ourselves to others. All we really should do is compare ourselves to ourselves. For example, I get in BIG trouble when I miss sleep. If I'm not careful, I set myself up for muscle and strength loss, and fat gain, and have to adjust my training accordingly.
So, strength gains in the MP. That's good. But again, see my corroboration of your "strong legs, strong Cleans" point.
Sounds like it. Cleans were too light. (28kg [12kg+16kg] vs. 56kg [32kg+24kg] - 1/2 as much load.) What do you think would happen if you were pressing / able to press the 32kg+24kg for the prescribed reps?
Again, this last point.
I'm not sure what you're saying here. In one instant you say you didn't meet the guardrails, but in the next, you say you couldn't "punch it," so you ended the set. In other words, you met the guardrails. Or am I missing something? Maybe you can elaborate?
I'm glad to hear this part. Are you able to put that 32+24kg over head using a Push Press? And if so, for how many reps? Because, depending on how many Cleans you can do with that load, that might be the stimulus needed to see the results you're after.
Let me know if this helps and if this makes sense.
GreenSoup
Level 6 Valued Member
I appreciate your response. The EM press strength guardrails specified that technique changes or slowing reps were a sign to stop pressing. In my case, thinking "punch" as if I were moving ballistically resulted in a press that was the same speed and form as reps earlier in the set. There were a few times that I completed sets this way that I otherwise could not have made.
On further review, since I had to think about the harder reps with a different approach, should this change in mentality about how to initiate the rep be regarded as a "technique change" and thereby time to stop the set and rest up for the next?
[edited addition: due to the cardio I've built up, the "start a set" guardrails were not as important as the question "could I press again?"]
This absolutely makes sense. Until I am stronger there is no way I can put a 32kg overhead unless I leave it upstairs though. Since I know what it's like *not* to be able to press, I absolutely plan to get stronger to get the most of a healed shoulder. Should I put pressing strength before the next EM plan?
Thank you for reviewing my Easy Muscle results.
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jmoran01
Level 5 Valued Member
My 5RM is 18 kg for the double C&P. Did day one Dry Fighting Weight and found I could only do ladders of 1, 2. The third rung was too hard with the C&P. I could try to push press the third. But stuck with ladders of 1,2. Will try to do the third again next Monday. Going to run the program like this. Maybe I can push press the last rep? Is this okay?
jmoran01
Level 5 Valued Member
I should that I played softball late last night (done at 10pm) and workout at 5am so was already tired going into this workout. Thinking next week will go better. Consider this my warm up week to DFW.