Other/Mixed Your Warm-Up Is Killing Your Workout... and Gains

[Boris Bachmann]

What if we could look at racehorses or greyhounds? Do they do better if you run them cold, or are they warmed up before the race? I know absolutely nothing about either (except that one is a horse and one is a dog that got caught in a trash compactor), but I wonder if they could inform the conversation at all. Animals in the wild aren't looking for peak performance, and as far as we know aren't capable of planning ahead, but humans use animals in sports so maybe there's a crossover.

Yeah, that's an idea. I'm guessing both racehorses and greyhounds are trained (and on PEDs) as well - how that figures into the larger picture, I don't know.

I guess I could start doing some internet browsing ... Or maybe I'll just go and make a cup of coffee and sit down with a book and try to read while my children jump on me... hmm decisions decisions...

Family time is always the priority

 

[Antti]

Like I said, I doubt there are numbers, but you only have to watch National Geographic occasionally to know it happens with some frequency. Again, like I said, I suspect they would indeed suffer less if they could warm up.

Well, they're not going to (and I guess neither are you), so...

Personally, I doubt there are numbers when it comes to wild animals and their injuries. I also doubt anything such is evident by watching it on some channel.

I'd love to see see some hard science or the anecdotes on warm-up or the lack of thereof.

As an example, I've read hundreds of warnings about heavy lifts and their injury risk. I've also personally witnessed many a meet in person and online, yet to see a single substantial injury happen, despite all the warnings of heavy loads on people. What gives?

 

[Boris Bachmann]

Personally, I doubt there are numbers when it comes to wild animals and their injuries. I also doubt anything such is evident by watching it on some channel.

Do you ever watch National Geographic animal kingdom shows? Maybe they're just cherry picking scenes, but animals limping away from chases is pretty common even when there was no tangle.

As an example, I've read hundreds of warnings about heavy lifts and their injury risk. I've also personally witnessed many a meet in person and online, yet to see a single substantial injury happen, despite all the warnings of heavy loads on people. What gives?

I've been to my share of meets. I have yet to see anyone do zero warm-up prior to their lifts. What gives?

 

[Philippe Geoffrion]

Like the story of the frog and

Do you ever watch National Geographic animal kingdom shows? Maybe they're just cherry picking scenes, but animals limping away from chases is pretty common even when there was no tangle.

I've been to my share of meets. I have yet to see anyone do zero warm-up prior to their lifts. What gives?

Perhaps we should distinguish the difference between performance in training vs performance at a competition or even regular gym goers vs professional athletes.

 

[watchnerd]

Yeah, that's an idea. I'm guessing both racehorses and greyhounds are trained (and on PEDs) as well - how that figures into the larger picture, I don't know.

I owned an ex-track greyhound from age 2 to 11.









Yes, they're on PEDs / steroids at the rack. Part of the halfway homing process before re-homing and adoption is dealing with getting them off the drugs. As well as assessing their prey drive -- they're not all suitable to become pets, and even the pet-worthy ones you have to watch them around small running animals (little dogs, cats) until they get socialized.

At the track, they lived in crates most of the week, let out once a day for an hour or so for light exercise (walking) from their handlers and going to the bathroom.

They lived only with other greyhounds. By the time race day rolled around, they were twitchy and ready to run.

As pets, they're couch potatoes -- except when they want to run. They're very much sprinters, not endurance runners.

If they don't get taken to a dog park and allowed to cut loose about once a week they get the zoomies.

 

[Don Fairbanks]

Perhaps we should distinguish the difference between performance in training vs performance at a competition or even regular gym goers vs professional athletes.

Like a $10 mill. F1 engine with tolerances which require an external heating source pumping hot water/ anti-freeze around the motor for 20 minutes or so prior to cranking it over.

 

[Don Fairbanks]

I owned an ex-track greyhound from age 2 to 11.

Yes, they're on PEDs / steroids. Part of the halfway homing process before re-homing and adoption is dealing with getting them off the drugs.

They were in crates most of the week, let out once a day for an hour or so for light exercise (walking) from their handlers and going to the bathroom.

They lived only with other greyhounds. By the time race day rolled around, they were twitchy and ready to run.

As pets, they're couch potatoes -- except when they want to run.

If they don't get taken to a dog park and allowed to cut loose about once a week they get the zoomies.

Brother had an Akita Pit-bull mix, real athletic. When he got older he would take off after a rabbit, squirrel, etc and pull a hammy/glute, etc, and would then walk funny for a good bit. Generally a daily occurrence.

 

[Boris Bachmann]

I owned an ex-track greyhound from age 2 to 11.

Beautiful dogs. I'd try to get one if it were up to me.

 

[Halfakneecap]

Like a $10 mill. F1 engine with tolerances which require an external heating source pumping hot water/ anti-freeze around the motor for 20 minutes or so prior to cranking it over.

Or, the flip side my trusty Toyota Corolla which just goes and goes and goes with very little maintenance ( I’m a maintenance worker so hate doing it at home ).Not as fun to drive though haha

 

[watchnerd]

Beautiful dogs. I'd try to get one if it were up to me.

They're amazing pets, too, from a temperament perspective -- very good and sweet natured, chill -- except when running.

(Kenji is the largest one on the far right, getting attention from some stranger. He was an especially large male, 32 inches tall at the shoulders).




We plan to get another in the future.

 

[Don Fairbanks]

A good, brief, wheel warm-up.

 

[Boris Bachmann]

They're amazing pets, too, from a temperament perspective -- very good and sweet natured, chill -- except when running.

(Kenji is the largest one on the far right, getting attention from some stranger. He was an especially large male, 32 inches tall at the shoulders).

My son's name is Kenji

 

[watchnerd]

My son's name is Kenji

His race name (racing greyhounds have weird sire / dam based names like race horses do) was BJ Bricklayer.

We tried a few times to see if he ever responded to that name, but he apparently never learned to.

 

[Antti]

Do you ever watch National Geographic animal kingdom shows? Maybe they're just cherry picking scenes, but animals limping away from chases is pretty common even when there was no tangle.

I've been to my share of meets. I have yet to see anyone do zero warm-up prior to their lifts. What gives?

I have to admit, I don't really watch any shows on animals. Though I do see some clips on social media but they're generally short.

The point I was trying to make was that the need of warm up could be equated to the fear of heavy loads inflicting injury. Both typical misconceptions that run rampant everywhere.

I'm not saying to do no warm up at all. I'm asking on what basis we should decide what to do and how.

 

[Boris Bachmann]

The point I was trying to make was that the need of warm up could be equated to the fear of heavy loads inflicting injury. Both typical misconceptions that run rampant everywhere.

Part of the warm up is psychological. If that has not been mentioned already, it should have been.

I'm not saying to do no warm up at all. I'm asking on what basis we should decide what to do and how.

Well, quite frankly, it kinda sounded like you were saying that you don't need to warm up...

I'd guess most of us who've been lifting and/or been around athletics pretty much our whole lives are going to fall into one of two camps - those that do what they do because that's what they've always done, and those that have struggled and through a lot of (sometimes painful) trial and error have figured out what seems to work. It doesn't take long to figure out what camp people are in generally speaking, but if you're wondering, my warm-up and the warm-up I have my athletes do have changed considerably over the years. Is there going to be bias and emotion involved in those experiences and decisions along the way? Absolutely - I wouldn't claim any different.

 

[Anna C]

Part of the warm up is psychological. If that has not been mentioned already, it should have been.

So true.

Military group training...

StrongFirst workshops and cert events....

General fitness group training....

It's always important to take that time to work into things... let everyone start to get focused by doing easy movement while the mind settles and lets go of all the things going on outside of training, getting mind and body connected, getting comfortable with group dynamics and instructor's style, time to survey external surroundings, time to survey internal state (how the body feels that day, if there are any malfunctions that need accommodation), etc..... all very beneficial EVEN IF there's no direct physicals benefits of the warm-up relative to the "real training" to follow. All very important to group training, but most of this is also true when training alone.

 

[watchnerd]

I'd guess most of us who've been lifting and/or been around athletics pretty much our whole lives are going to fall into one of two camps - those that do what they do because that's what they've always done, and those that have struggled and through a lot of (sometimes painful) trial and error have figured out what seems to work. It doesn't take long to figure out what camp people are in generally speaking, but if you're wondering, my warm-up and the warm-up I have my athletes do have changed considerably over the years. Is there going to be bias and emotion involved in those experiences and decisions along the way? Absolutely - I wouldn't claim any different.

Trial and error (for me) is that if I don't warm up enough:

1. Post-workout soreness and stiffness is higher
2. ROM isn't as good
3. More likely to 'tweak something' or get some other localized twinge, because movement pattern is off or asymmetrical
4. Measured bar velocity is lower -- things just aren't firing at full force
5. Reaction time is slower

 

[Antti]

Part of the warm up is psychological. If that has not been mentioned already, it should have been.

Well, quite frankly, it kinda sounded like you were saying that you don't need to warm up...

I'd guess most of us who've been lifting and/or been around athletics pretty much our whole lives are going to fall into one of two camps - those that do what they do because that's what they've always done, and those that have struggled and through a lot of (sometimes painful) trial and error have figured out what seems to work. It doesn't take long to figure out what camp people are in generally speaking, but if you're wondering, my warm-up and the warm-up I have my athletes do have changed considerably over the years. Is there going to be bias and emotion involved in those experiences and decisions along the way? Absolutely - I wouldn't claim any different.

I agree on the psychological part.

When considering the need for warm up, it just seems simple to start from the minimum and see where it falls short. I'm asking, not telling how to do it.

I do think a lot of training can be done with no warm up. Back when I was doing GTG C&P, I could go from zero to hundred. I believe it was expected of the method. And a C&P 1RM is taxing, even if it is a unilateral kettlebell lift. I never saw or felt any downsides to the lack of warm up. Would it be different with a floor press? Two kettlebells? Barbell? Where do we draw the line?

 

[watchnerd]

Oh another one:

If I'm not warmed up enough, my aggression is much less

(this was just as true when I was playing football as it is weightlifting)

 

[Manuel Fortin]

That’s astonishing…quite sad too. The cat kills it only to fulfill a predatory instinct and not because it needs to eat. I suppose domesticated creatures still need a hint of wildness.

Well, for my cat, it seems to prefer a lot more the preys it hunts to the cat food I buy. It doesn't eat before hunting, and will only go back home at night in the summer if the hunt wasn't good (and will then devour whatever I serve). Small rodent hunting is not a bug for me, it's a feature. I live adjacent a few undeveloped lots in a stone walled house. Before I had a cat, mice were a regular occurrence in the house. Enough that traps were not a very good option. Had to use poison. Now, I can get one or two a year, but that's it. How do I know the mice are eaten? 1 - I often find in my yard half-eaten mice (cat usually leaves the intestines alone). 2 - Some day, I barely have to feed the cat, sometimes down to a third to half the usual winter quantity, when the cat doesn't go out as it hates snow.