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Strong Endurance Strong Endurance Express!

My most concise summary: Pulls apart the Cardiovascular system into its component parts, explains the relevant physiology and biochemistry in a way that's easy to understand and then applies it to all training levels from beginner to Olympian to explain how you not only start, but progress, in the most metabolically effective way to preserve and enhance mitochondrial function. Life is a trade off, and this course explains the trade off extremely well.
 
Would be good if you could buy the modules separately, quite fancy the metal heart stuff.
 
Adachi said:
For those of us who have not had the pleasure of a Strong Endurance Seminar, (I have perused the materials and am going through the videos now) I can tell you that this does cover the Meat and Potatoes of the course, and will help provide you with the context and understanding necessary to engage in a range of protocols under the Strong Endurance Paradigm.

It is much cheaper than the seminar and touches all the bases of training and performance from a strong endurance perspective.

While it is not quite as in-depth on the biochemistry and discussion of its relationship to the electron transport chain, a broad range of issues around training and performance are explored.

It is available via Skilltrain at the below link.

StrongFirst: Training Center

strongfirst.skilltrain.com strongfirst.skilltrain.com
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I’m struggling to pull the trigger on it. I know it's Worth it but yea it’s pricey for me right now (construction worker. Rain. No work. Etc). What makes it different than the book? Or should i say As well, what even makes it worth it?
 
conor78 said:
Watched all 6 modules and have run over the pdf once. Will need a few revisits to even begin to digest this. An amazing resource. It really fleshes out the QD/AXE approach. You can see the lineage with Pavel’s timeless article the cost of adaptation.
A serious investment..
Thanks Pavel
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Yes. There's no way I'm going to get it all on first viewing, so it bears repeated viewings.
 
Brandon Trahan said:
I’m struggling to pull the trigger on it. I know it's Worth it but yea it’s pricey for me right now (construction worker. Rain. No work. Etc). What makes it different than the book? Or should i say As well, what even makes it worth it?
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Underlying principles which can be applied outside of KB, BW, BB and an excellent overview of mitochondrial physiology and biochemistry and how it applies to the cardio, pulmonary and vascular systems. Key information for longevity and health.
 
Denys Carthusian said:
Underlying principles which can be applied outside of KB, BW, BB and an excellent overview of mitochondrial physiology and biochemistry and how it applies to the cardio, pulmonary and vascular systems. Key information for longevity and health.
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Given what I've spent on health therapies and testing. Personally, the $300 for the Metal Heart segment is worth the price alone. Optimal training for mitochondrial health has the side bonus of being fantastic for your heart. Worth its weight in gold.
 
I like it a lot.

Something that would make the manual more user friendly, though, is a dedicated program/protocol section, divided into which category they each fall under.

Meaning, here’s the Axe protocols, here’s the IC protocols, here’s the Metal Heart protocols, etc. similar to the PlanStrong Manual which has an entire section in the back of just protocols/programs. Currently, the SEE protocols are very frequently mixed in/sprinkled throughout the rest of the manual based on what module they appeared in. That makes it hard to locate them.

Ideally, organizing the protocols based on how best to proceed from one to the next would be great, but I understand that that is probably goal specific. Additionally, referencing where the various Speed Metal programs (or other products like QD or SS or KBSF) fall in the spectrum (or out of it, if they are something else entirely), would also be helpful. I get that you wouldn’t spell out the details of those products because they are purchased separately, but they can at least be placed in the hierarchy/tree and if someone wants details they can go get those as well.

That would make it WAY simpler for those of us that have the various products (or even just this one stellar product), and want to get a big picture of how everything lays out and fits together. Think of it as the box cover for the puzzle so we have a reference and guide for doing the work and putting it all together.

Again, it’s a great product and I highly recommend it. This would just be a really good, supremely helpful, and almost-necessary addition to make it more practical for use after watching all the modules and reading the manual.
 
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100% agree with Sam

I have watched all the videos and read the PDF - I have no idea where to start? How to choose which program? How to integrate it into my current steady state training.
 
Sam Goldner said:
I like it a lot.

Something that would make the manual more user friendly, though, is a dedicated program/protocol section, divided into which category they each fall under.

Meaning, here’s the Axe protocols, here’s the IC protocols, here’s the Metal Heart protocols, etc. similar to the PlanStrong Manual which has an entire section in the back of just protocols/programs. Currently, the SEE protocols are very frequently mixed in/sprinkled throughout the rest of the manual based on what module they appeared in. Ideally, organizing the protocols based on how best to proceed from one to the next would be great, but I understand that that is probably goal specific. Additionally, referencing where the various Speed Metal programs (or other products like QD or SS or KBSF) fall in the spectrum (or out of it, if they are something else entirely), would also be helpful. I get that you wouldn’t spell out the details of those products because they are purchased separately, but they can at least be placed in the hierarchy/tree and if someone wants details they can go get those as well.

That would make it WAY simpler for those of us that have the various products (or even just this one stellar product), and want to get a big picture of how everything lays out and fits together. Think of it as the box cover for the puzzle so we have a reference and guide for doing the work and putting it all together.

Again, it’s a great product and I highly recommend it. This would just be a really good, supremely helpful, and almost-necessary addition to make it more practical for use after watching all the modules and reading the manual.
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Maybe those items were left out on purpose. I dont know if that is true, but thats the impression I got. The “do this” and when programs are already out there.

I think SE and SEE are for those looking to go to the next level. They provide the knowledge so you can chart your own course. It would be hard to provide what you ask for as there are dozens of goals or outcomes possible with the material. How is Pavel to know your intended outcome?

This next part is not directed towards anyone. It seems people today think things should be handed to them. If it isn’t easy their feathers get ruffled. At some point you gotta try things and figure out what works for you. Not everything works for everybody the same way.
 
Jtminster said:
Maybe those items were left out on purpose. I dont know if that is true, but thats the impression I got. The “do this” and when programs are already out there.

I think SE and SEE are for those looking to go to the next level. They provide the knowledge so you can chart your own course. It would be hard to provide what you ask for as there are dozens of goals or outcomes possible with the material. How is Pavel to know your intended outcome?

This next part is not directed towards anyone. It seems people today think things should be handed to them. If it isn’t easy their feathers get ruffled. At some point you gotta try things and figure out what works for you. Not everything works for everybody the same way.
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I get that there are different goals and therefore different paths, so maybe that’s not practical. I addressed that in my post (and I understand you qualified your final paragraph, so don’t think I’m being defensive).

My main point is the programs/protocols are sprinkled all throughout the manual, instead of in a dedicated section. That’s an organizational issue that has nothing to do with which program leads to the next. It makes it hard to find them for future reference, which makes the manual significantly less user-friendly than it could be. The PlanStrong Manual has a dedicated program/protocol section; doing something like that would be great, and is apparently doable because it’s already been done in other manuals. Leave them where they are throughout so the flow follows the modules, and then also have them in an appendix.

Additionally, it’s not always clear which part of the AGT spectrum each program falls under. Having the appendix organized like that (or at least a program tree showing which branch each protocol comes off of) would be very clarifying. My point about QD/SpeedMetal/KBSF and other programs is once you do something like what I just wrote, adding those into the tree isn’t a big deal and again is very clarifying. It also doesn’t require giving details of the programs, and, if anything, funnels people to buy those products to get the details.

Think of the last paragraph like the timelines/lists people make for watching/reading Star Wars or Marvel or whatever where there are tons of options and various series all under the greater umbrella. Strongfirst now has a ton of great products, and even within this single product there are multiple options (beyond the ones we can now make thanks to what we learned in this course). A tree/timeline/whatever you want to call it would also be very helpful in the appendix that I’m saying would be helpful.
 
I think your points are valid, it isnt that I disagree. We have no idea of Pavel’s intentions.

The other thought for me is it’s an express, things have to be dropped or not included given the price point. We cant expect it to look like the plan strong manual, that would likely drive the cost up.
 
Sam Goldner said:
I get that there are different goals and therefore different paths, so maybe that’s not practical. I addressed that in my post (and I understand you qualified your final paragraph, so don’t think I’m being defensive).

My main point is the programs/protocols are sprinkled all throughout the manual, instead of in a dedicated section. That’s an organizational issue that has nothing to do with which program leads to the next. It makes it hard to find them for future reference, which makes the manual significantly less user-friendly than it could be. The PlanStrong Manual has a dedicated program/protocol section; doing something like that would be great, and is apparently doable because it’s already been done in other manuals. Leave them where they are throughout so the flow follows the modules, and then also have them in an appendix.

Additionally, it’s not always clear which part of the AGT spectrum each program falls under. Having the appendix organized like that (or at least a program tree showing which branch each protocol comes off of) would be very clarifying. My point about QD/SpeedMetal/KBSF and other programs is once you do something like what I just wrote, adding those into the tree isn’t a big deal and again is very clarifying. It also doesn’t require giving details of the programs, and, if anything, funnels people to buy those products to get the details.

Think of the last paragraph like the timelines/lists people make for watching/reading Star Wars or Marvel or whatever where there are tons of options and various series all under the greater umbrella. Strongfirst now has a ton of great products, and even within this single product there are multiple options (beyond the ones we can now make thanks to what we learned in this course). A tree/timeline/whatever you want to call it would also be very helpful in the appendix that I’m saying would be helpful.
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I get completely what you're saying about the manual, although, one could argue it's organized by training adaptation in the module... Ex metal heart= more aerobic in nature training thus 060 etc is in that section

Also as to goals, it does have the goals listed at the top of the protocols!

Overall though I agree with your opinion on it not being the most user friendly
 
kenaces said:
100% agree with Sam

I have watched all the videos and read the PDF - I have no idea where to start? How to choose which program? How to integrate it into my current steady state training.
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I know this is the most unsatisfactory answer ever, but choosing a program will depend on where you are and what goals you have. I have no intention of doing the bodyweight lunges protocol. I don't need that type of endurance! So what goals are you currently working on, or where would you like to go?

This is also an unsatisfactory answer, and I don't always agree when other coaches say this, but I like the idea of starting the SE journey with S&S. Notice there is a template for an alternate S&S progression. Maybe push for the simple standard, or if you've already gotten it in the past, just rack up some training time with swings and get-ups, then transition. I would go to AXE (the program as written in the book, not the general heading). If you are proficient with H2H swings, go for it, but standard 1H and 2H is fine. These are two excellent GPP protocols.

After that? You could transition to 524. Very similar to AXE but focused on the snatch test. I've run this protocol twice, once doing 524 into 523, and once 524 back to back. I felt like a beast and just crushed the snatch test.

And after that?? Maybe 024 or 025, and then 060. So there is a bit of a progression. S&S builds to heavier AXE swings, then add in snatching with 524, then mostly snatching with 024/5 plus adding reps, then snatching and increasing density with 060. Reassess goals after.

This is just one way, and it comes from having just taken ATC (for a second time) and seeing the progression that Derek and Kenneth laid out. Think of your goals, and then think of progressing (NASA quote in the manual - ideally change one variable at a time and run it until it becomes constant, then change another variable). Hope it helps a little to shed some light.
 
Sam Goldner said:
I get that there are different goals and therefore different paths, so maybe that’s not practical. I addressed that in my post (and I understand you qualified your final paragraph, so don’t think I’m being defensive).

My main point is the programs/protocols are sprinkled all throughout the manual, instead of in a dedicated section. That’s an organizational issue that has nothing to do with which program leads to the next. It makes it hard to find them for future reference, which makes the manual significantly less user-friendly than it could be. The PlanStrong Manual has a dedicated program/protocol section; doing something like that would be great, and is apparently doable because it’s already been done in other manuals. Leave them where they are throughout so the flow follows the modules, and then also have them in an appendix.

Additionally, it’s not always clear which part of the AGT spectrum each program falls under. Having the appendix organized like that (or at least a program tree showing which branch each protocol comes off of) would be very clarifying. My point about QD/SpeedMetal/KBSF and other programs is once you do something like what I just wrote, adding those into the tree isn’t a big deal and again is very clarifying. It also doesn’t require giving details of the programs, and, if anything, funnels people to buy those products to get the details.

Think of the last paragraph like the timelines/lists people make for watching/reading Star Wars or Marvel or whatever where there are tons of options and various series all under the greater umbrella. Strongfirst now has a ton of great products, and even within this single product there are multiple options (beyond the ones we can now make thanks to what we learned in this course). A tree/timeline/whatever you want to call it would also be very helpful in the appendix that I’m saying would be helpful.
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I’d just do the tactical barbell 2: conditioning approach. Spend some time building up your base, then advance high priority and maintain lower priority.
 
John DeStefano said:
I know this is the most unsatisfactory answer ever, but choosing a program will depend on where you are and what goals you have. I have no intention of doing the bodyweight lunges protocol. I don't need that type of endurance! So what goals are you currently working on, or where would you like to go?

This is also an unsatisfactory answer, and I don't always agree when other coaches say this, but I like the idea of starting the SE journey with S&S. Notice there is a template for an alternate S&S progression. Maybe push for the simple standard, or if you've already gotten it in the past, just rack up some training time with swings and get-ups, then transition. I would go to AXE (the program as written in the book, not the general heading). If you are proficient with H2H swings, go for it, but standard 1H and 2H is fine. These are two excellent GPP protocols.

After that? You could transition to 524. Very similar to AXE but focused on the snatch test. I've run this protocol twice, once doing 524 into 523, and once 524 back to back. I felt like a beast and just crushed the snatch test.

And after that?? Maybe 024 or 025, and then 060. So there is a bit of a progression. S&S builds to heavier AXE swings, then add in snatching with 524, then mostly snatching with 024/5 plus adding reps, then snatching and increasing density with 060. Reassess goals after.

This is just one way, and it comes from having just taken ATC (for a second time) and seeing the progression that Derek and Kenneth laid out. Think of your goals, and then think of progressing (NASA quote in the manual - ideally change one variable at a time and run it until it becomes constant, then change another variable). Hope it helps a little to shed some light.
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I plan on reviewing the material and asking more specific questions in the course.

Thanks for your advice - maybe I can ask for more :)

I am 54 years young and rock climb ~3 days per week. I have been doing plan 015(swings/pushups) and 3x3 press/squat/pull-up each once a week(last ~3 months) I do not own the simple standard and would likely be considered weak by SF standards(except in pull-ups). I get ~3 days a week of hiking or rucking(climbing approaches) most weeks. The goal is to improve my all-day mountain fitness/endurance so I can do some longer rock climbs and maybe some alpine routes.

I see a lot of value in the KB swings but they impact my climbing as I am already loading my grip a lot. I am considering trying to do more AGT endurance work each week - maybe with other modalities(box jump, sled pushes, ski erg...), or try AXE swings as maybe 4r won't affect my grip as much as the 10r in plan 015(could be AXE SS like you mentioned), or mix it up by rotating through an AXE workout with swings, then box jumps, then ski erg. Thoughts?
 
kenaces said:
I plan on reviewing the material and asking more specific questions in the course.

Thanks for your advice - maybe I can ask for more :)

I am 54 years young and rock climb ~3 days per week. I have been doing plan 015(swings/pushups) and 3x3 press/squat/pull-up each once a week(last ~3 months) I do not own the simple standard and would likely be considered weak by SF standards(except in pull-ups). I get ~3 days a week of hiking or rucking(climbing approaches) most weeks. The goal is to improve my all-day mountain fitness/endurance so I can do some longer rock climbs and maybe some alpine routes.

I see a lot of value in the KB swings but they impact my climbing as I am already loading my grip a lot. I am considering trying to do more AGT endurance work each week - maybe with other modalities(box jump, sled pushes, ski erg...), or try AXE swings as maybe 4r won't affect my grip as much as the 10r in plan 015(could be AXE SS like you mentioned), or mix it up by rotating through an AXE workout with swings, then box jumps, then ski erg. Thoughts?
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My thoughts are that you are a great candidate for All-Terrain Conditioning! Reach out to Derek Toshner and Kenneth Bolyard, and check Derek's site - Home - Adventure Fit

Interestingly, plan 015 is used as a base plan in ATC. If it's taxing your grip too much, I would recommend the companion plan 017 - same set-up but half the reps on 45s. Also consider doing 2H swings in any of your AGT plans.

Not sure about jumps, sleds, and ski. Just because I don't use them much. I think they could be fine, would just need to consider their role in the goal.

Have you seen the step-up training article? - “Step Up” Your Adventure Training | StrongFirst

GTG also would be a great tool for your grip training. There seem to be hints of some GTG project coming soon......
 
kenaces said:
100% agree with Sam

I have watched all the videos and read the PDF - I have no idea where to start? How to choose which program? How to integrate it into my current steady state training.
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The plans have goals/adaptations in the summary

You could easily start with the AXE protocol (524A) progress to metal heart 025 then Q&D (044?) That gets you snatching heavy (524) building volume (025) making the volume more enduring (044)

If you're just wanting general fitness then 060 -> 024 -> 044 would be my go-to

Toss in some military presses on alt days (or get-ups) and you're good

If you want to use C&J's then use the KBSF jerk protocol then -> 550 protocol from SEE
 
Pavel said:
“For the average person just looking to handle what life throws their way, is there value in buying SE express? I have Q&D, KBSF, speed metal, AXE and IC, do I need this?”

Probably not.


Adachi, well said! And your “L” shaped graph is spot on.
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Appreciate this. I really want to buy this but will have to wait. Can't justify the cost while saving for SFG and using AXE and Q&D for snatch prep and Iron Cardio for other movement prep.

Also echoing thanks to @Adachi for the L graph. Really effective way to break it all down to one image.
 
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