Barbell Can I lose weight and gain strength at the same time using greasing the groove?

[HendrixExperience]

As far as I know, greasing the groove focuses mainly on the neurological side of gaining strength and doesn't really break down the muscles involved in the movement. I'm looking to increase my strength on the bench (135lbs) and squat (200lbs) using greasing the groove, which I can do because I have a home gym. I'm also looking to lose body fat at the same time. I weigh 200lbs standing 6'10 (m) and I want to cut down to 170lbs. My idea is that I can eat at maintenance most days but perhaps over the weekend I can eat at a deficit. Because I'm never going to failure, perhaps my body won't need as many calories to recover so I can afford this small deficit?

 

[Anna C]

I think your logic is sound from an energy standpoint. GTG is usually a short effort, so that uses mostly PCr in the muscles and doesn't take you much into glycolysis. So if you're in a caloric deficit and/or glycogyen stores are low, it won't affect you as much.

As for GTG increasing your 1RM strength on squat and bench, I'd be surprised if you got great (i.e. better than a standard strength-building program) results using GTG, but apparently it can be done. There have been past posts on this, which you can find with the Search feature. Here is one with some advice: Barbell - Barbell Grease the Groove

And purely on the fat loss side, I'd also be surprised if you lost much if you were eating at a maintenance 5 days out of the week and only a slight or moderate deficit on the weekends. That doesn't add up to much of a weekly deficit, and the margin of error becomes pretty small. One extra snack on a Saturday and treat on Sunday and you're back at maintenance. Plus, who really eats at a deficit on the weekends? Maybe if you do a 24 hour fast or so...

Regarding "perhaps my body won't need as many calories to recover" ... I would think in terms of your body needing protein to recover, instead of calories. Give your body adequate protein to recover, rebuild your muscles, and get stronger. The overall calories, if your body needs more, will come from body fat... which will help you towards your goals, not hurt you.

But if those are your methods of choice, you could be successful. Those are just my thoughts. Let us know how it goes!

 

[Ivan Merl]

Did you mean that you are 6'1"?

Dropping to 170 at a hight of 6'10" might be a bad idea.

 

[Mark Limbaga]

Do you want to lose weight for a sport or you actually mean lose body fat?

 

[pet']

Hello,

In this article, GTG is used as a "weight control strategy": “160 Seconds a Day Keep the Doctor Away!”—Burn More Fat and Improve Your Health without Breaking a Sweat with a Simple Swing Protocol | StrongFirst

However, it is performed with a kettlebell, but the sprint is also mentioned. If both options are not possible, then I guess a sets of 5 to 10 burpees can be an alternative. For barbell option, maybe clean & jerks.

Intermittent fasting by skipping breakfast can also be considered to progressively lose a little bit of bodyfat. It will be very smooth and this approach is - IMHO - slightly more convenient than thinking about calorie deficit / maintenance.

Kind regards,

Pet'

 

[Timo Keskitalo]

In my experience weightloss is possible only when you sport (run) so much that you refuse to eat enough to compensate. Or your metabolism is such that it can't compensate. Many things can be done, but what is the willpower...

 

[Daniel Vintila]

Calories IN vs Calories out. Simple ast that. You need to eat less than what your body would need in a day. Usually you can start at cutting around 500 calories per day and see how it goes.
Then the quality of what you eat will affect your performance in the gym. Good quality food and enough protein to help build muscle, which then gets stronger, together with a decent strength building plan and boom new RM.
Choosing a GTG approach won't burn nearly as many calories as you would think, and lifting weights only, in general doesn't burn a lot of calories. Cardio activities do.
So you either cut a lot of calories (but keep your protein intake at around 1g per lbs) or add some cardio to your routine.

Anyway I am not a certified nutritionist so please feel free to disregard everything I've said.

 

[GaryT]

As far as I know, greasing the groove focuses mainly on the neurological side of gaining strength and doesn't really break down the muscles involved in the movement. I'm looking to increase my strength on the bench (135lbs) and squat (200lbs) using greasing the groove, which I can do because I have a home gym. I'm also looking to lose body fat at the same time. I weigh 200lbs standing 6'10 (m) and I want to cut down to 170lbs. My idea is that I can eat at maintenance most days but perhaps over the weekend I can eat at a deficit. Because I'm never going to failure, perhaps my body won't need as many calories to recover so I can afford this small deficit?

I think so. I slimmed down a coupla years ago (15 lbs) while GtG for various forms of pull-ups. We had quit the gym a several years ago and I had not done pull-ups in years but gave it a go. I wasn’t really overweight and some weight loss was not necessarily fat loss.

I worked up to thirteen. Admittedly, losing weight is a great way to increase pull-ups though but GtG was awesome. I gained some lat width although it was not my focus. I was 62 at the time. I actually made a video for a form check at the time and put it on UTube to explore how to load it.

Gymnastic Ring Pull Ups - (Age 62)

 

[HendrixExperience]

Did you mean that you are 6'1"?

Dropping to 170 at a hight of 6'10" might be a bad idea

yes, I'm so sorry, that was a ridiculous mistake! lol

 

[Kenny Croxdale]

greasing the groove focuses mainly on the neurological side of gaining strength

Technique Development

It more about developing Technique than gaining strength.

I weigh 200lbs standing 6'1 (m) and I want to cut down to 170lbs.

Body Fat Percentage

Individual with higher percentages of body fat are usually able to lose weight and increase muscle mass and strength.

Individual who are fairly lean tend to lose some muscle mass and strength when they drop weight. That is one of the reason some sport have weight classes.

Calories IN vs Calories out.

Calories Below Maintenance

Calories count, regardless of the diet you select.

Usually you can start at cutting around 500 calories per day and see how it goes.

20% Decrease In Daily Calorie Intake

Research from Dr John Ivy and Dr Layne Norton determined it maximized fat loss while minimizing muscle loss.

Daniel's 500 calorie cut per day falls into the range for most.

However, you first need to determine how many calorie you are consuming daily. This is accomplished with a...

Three Day Recall

1) Count you calories for three days.

One of the three days need to be a weekend day; since most individual diet change on the weekend.

2) Then divide the total by three to obtain your daily average.

3) Then decrease your calorie intake 20%.

My idea is that I can eat at maintenance most days but perhaps over the weekend I can eat at a deficit.

Weekly Calorie Intake

Eating fewer calories will work, if that is your choice.

Dropping 30 lbs

That will take a while. Your weight loss will most likely stall at some point.

That because your Metabolic Rate will Reset to make your new lower Calorie Intake your new Maintenance Level.

Overcoming The Stall

Once the body adjust to your new lower calorie intake, you need to increase you calorie intake for a couple of weeks.

Doing so Resets your Metabolic Rate at a higher Maintenance Level.

Once that occurs, you then decrease your calorie intake for a few week or until you stall.

Research shows this method is effective at losing fat and maintaining muscle mass.

 

[John Spezzano]

Almost all of us can definitely be lighter but still stronger. As asked previously, are you trying to lose "weight" or lose "fat," and for what reason? Either way you should do some kind of body composition test now, repeat it on a regular basis (monthly or quarterly, for example) and start tracking the results. I personally prefer the hydrostatic testing, but there are a number of methods out there.

In my opinion, your diet is far more important than your training when it comes to changing your body composition. Training is certainly a factor, but diet is far more powerful in this arena. There are countless methods out there to try: keto, paleo, primal, intermittent fasting, Parillo, etc, etc. Read up on them and see which one makes the most sense to you and more important, which one seems the most SUSTAINABLE! Calorie restriction alone is not sustainable and after a while will end poorly.

 

[Gerry K]

As far as I know, greasing the groove focuses mainly on the neurological side of gaining strength and doesn't really break down the muscles involved in the movement. I'm looking to increase my strength on the bench (135lbs) and squat (200lbs) using greasing the groove, which I can do because I have a home gym. I'm also looking to lose body fat at the same time. I weigh 200lbs standing 6'10 (m) and I want to cut down to 170lbs. My idea is that I can eat at maintenance most days but perhaps over the weekend I can eat at a deficit. Because I'm never going to failure, perhaps my body won't need as many calories to recover so I can afford this small deficit?

You can lose weight without exercising so you should be able to do so with minimal exercising.

At the risk of getting flamed, I will speak from personal experience with fat loss. “Calories in vs calories out” is simplistic. What you eat, and when, is far more important than how much. You can eat unlimited amounts of broccoli, even smothered in butter or cheese, and you won’t get fat.

That’s because what you eat elicits a hormonal response that drives either fat-burning or fat-accumulation.

I recommend a “cycled ketogenic diet” for optimal fat-burning based on my personal experience as an FFB (former fat boy).

 

[Halfakneecap]

I just eat a small deficit, 300 cal maybe. I have enough energy to do S&S without gassing out, and I dont feel like I’m starving. I eat all food groups at whatever time of day and so never feel like I’m depriving myself of a biscuit or 5 with my afternoon tea or a few beers here or there. They all get tracked in my app and I lose weight. It’s slower progress but much sustainable than watching the clock waiting to eat X mixed with Y for Z hormonal response etc.

If you don’t have an extreme composition goal, you don’t need an extreme nutrition plan.


EDIT. Apologies if I came across harsh, I work with someone doing keto and I get a bit sick of hearing things like “carrots are just pure sugar” when the bloke is eating 8 Frankfurt’s for lunch and eats protein bars all day long ( low carb obviously! ). But doesn’t track daily calories ( dont need to on keto according to him )

 

[Dayz]

GTG will work to get stronger while losing weight but barbell Squat/ Bench wouldn't be my choice.

Why don't you run a minimalist barbell program like PTTP with Squat/ Bench then use pullups or body rows GTG? That covers your Squat- Push- Pull movements. Just a thought

 

[BJJ Shawn]

You can lose weight without exercising so you should be able to do so with minimal exercising.

At the risk of getting flamed, I will speak from personal experience with fat loss. “Calories in vs calories out” is simplistic. What you eat, and when, is far more important than how much. You can eat unlimited amounts of broccoli, even smothered in butter or cheese, and you won’t get fat.

That’s because what you eat elicits a hormonal response that drives either fat-burning or fat-accumulation.

I recommend a “cycled ketogenic diet” for optimal fat-burning based on my personal experience as an FFB (former fat boy).

That’s simply not true. Your body doesn’t ignore the laws of thermodynamics just because you eat different foods. Your body learns to be more efficient to reduce staving, such as fidgeting less and reducing energy for things like NEAT, but you simply can’t create or reduce energy so calories in vs calories out is still a firm rule.

 

[Gerry K]

That’s simply not true. Your body doesn’t ignore the laws of thermodynamics just because you eat different foods. Your body learns to be more efficient to reduce staving, such as fidgeting less and reducing energy for things like NEAT, but you simply can’t create or reduce energy so calories in vs calories out is still a firm rule.

I couldn’t disagree more. In cases of starvation and gluttony, calories in vs calories out matters, but in between the extremes, it didn’t for me. Metabolism is a dynamic process that is tied to hormonal response to what you ingest.

But i won’t argue on the internet. If you can make calorie counting work, good for you.

 

[HendrixExperience]

Did you mean that you are 6'1"?

Dropping to 170 at a hight of 6'10" might be a bad idea.

yep, that was a mistake, lol

As asked previously, are you trying to lose "weight" or lose "fat," and for what reason?

I'm want to lose weight (body fat) for the military, and at the same time, I want to continue to gain strength in my barbell lifts. I don't want to use GTG to help accelerate weight loss, rather I'm wondering if it is a good method to use to continue to increase my strength while my calories are restricted.

 

[HendrixExperience]

Calories IN vs Calories out. Simple ast that. You need to eat less than what your body would need in a day. Usually you can start at cutting around 500 calories per day and see how it goes.
Then the quality of what you eat will affect your performance in the gym. Good quality food and enough protein to help build muscle, which then gets stronger, together with a decent strength building plan and boom new RM.
Choosing a GTG approach won't burn nearly as many calories as you would think, and lifting weights only, in general doesn't burn a lot of calories. Cardio activities do.
So you either cut a lot of calories (but keep your protein intake at around 1g per lbs) or add some cardio to your routine.

Anyway I am not a certified nutritionist so please feel free to disregard everything I've said.

I'm not seeking to use GTG for accelerating weight loss, but as a method to use to continue to increase strength while my calories are restricted. Sorry I wasn't clear enough in the original post

 

[HendrixExperience]

Do you want to lose weight for a sport or you actually mean lose body fat?

I'm looking to drop weight for the army and at the same time continue to increase my strength while cutting. I'm wondering if GTG would be the way to do that because from what I understand it doesn't break down the muscles nearly as much so in theory, I can still recover and gain strength with fewer calories.

 

[Dayz]

That’s simply not true. Your body doesn’t ignore the laws of thermodynamics just because you eat different foods. Your body learns to be more efficient to reduce staving, such as fidgeting less and reducing energy for things like NEAT, but you simply can’t create or reduce energy so calories in vs calories out is still a firm rule.

I don't think he's saying CICO is "wrong", just that it's simplistic, which it is.**

Calorie type and timing is also incredibly important, due to things like calorie partitioning, calrie preferencing, and various other hormonal responses that fundamentally change what your body decides to do with its calories.

Per the science, best results will be experienced factoring in both. You can get great results by just implementing one simplistic strategy though, then may need to factor in the more complex stuff if you stall or want to get ultra lean.

Most people can get pretty good results in the beginning by just skipping breakfast, for example.


** noting that simplicity can be a strength or weakness.