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Kettlebell AXE Training Thread

Christophe said:
Currently 1.5 month later and still respecting the LTHR of 85%. Based on body it should be fine. Added the double espresso glycolytic session once. Didn’t last long as expected.
Regarding progress, there is none unfortunately. Still always at the 12-13 min mark when the heart rate monitor kills the fun. Today even had to quit after set 9, so below the minimum. I’m reconsidering what to do, I’m now 3.5 months in with basically no progress, in or outside gym. Maybe I should try building a base with 5 reps first, or try to push 4 reps until 40 minutes.
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Two questions: are you still at 85% LTHR at the end of the rest period, or just sometime in the session? Second, how did you calculate your LTHR?
 
mfbunch said:
Two questions: are you still at 85% LTHR at the end of the rest period, or just sometime in the session? Second, how did you calculate your LTHR?
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Before the start of the set (or actually 3-5s before) I check, and if it is below 85% I do the set.
I calculated it by (180-age) x 0.85. I should do a proper test at some point.
 
Christophe said:
Before the start of the set (or actually 3-5s before) I check, and if it is below 85% I do the set.
I calculated it by (180-age) x 0.85. I should do a proper test at some point.
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Interesting. I used the highest heart rate I did during a series of 5Ks I ran over the last year (196 BPM) and took 85% of that as my number.
 
LoneRider said:
Interesting. I used the highest heart rate I did during a series of 5Ks I ran over the last year (196 BPM) and took 85% of that as my number.
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As a (former?) powerlifter I didn’t run and don’t have such data hehe. But I started with the running/rucking again slowly.
 
Christophe said:
Before the start of the set (or actually 3-5s before) I check, and if it is below 85% I do the set.
I calculated it by (180-age) x 0.85. I should do a proper test at some point.
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I'd try to find true max heart rate. I'm 50 but I use my highest recorded heart rate over the last six months of 178. You may be setting the bar too low.
 
What formula do you use to calculate heart rate?

220-age?
Maffetone?
<85%
Which is better?
 
220 - age to find the max heart rate approximation is more likely to be wrong than right. At 48 my measured max heart rate was 203 bpm. Per the formula that should have only been 172 bpm which is closer to my current LT2 value at 50. Others will be on the opposite end of the spectrum and the approximation is much higher.

The only way to know is to test in a lab or use a field test. If you're a numbers freak, a gas-exchange VO2 max test will find your LT1 and LT2 turn points. Basically, they put a mask on you to measure the CO2 you're exhaling. During the test you peddle on an ERG bike or run on a treadmill with increasing effort every minute until you blow-up. For a field test find a good hill that will take you one minute to ascend at all out effort. Record your heart-rate, walk back down and repeat four times. Compare the last to heart rate values and it should have maxed out at max effort. Both methods will test your grit.

That's why Talk Test is generally preferred to keep you under LT1. If you can finish two short sentences out loud with slight effort, you're there. If you can talk easily, you're slacking off.
 
Christophe said:
Currently 1.5 month later and still respecting the LTHR of 85%. Based on body it should be fine. Added the double espresso glycolytic session once. Didn’t last long as expected.
Regarding progress, there is none unfortunately. Still always at the 12-13 min mark when the heart rate monitor kills the fun. Today even had to quit after set 9, so below the minimum. I’m reconsidering what to do, I’m now 3.5 months in with basically no progress, in or outside gym. Maybe I should try building a base with 5 reps first, or try to push 4 reps until 40 minutes.
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From everything I've read and my own experience you want to be below 70% before starting the repeat if not pull the plug. Maybe that's why you're stuck? There is a post in this thread from @Derek Toshner that outlines a number of key points. Sounds like you might want to back down the weight and get some 20 to 40 minute sessions in consistently? All the best bro!
 
Aziatik said:
From everything I've read and my own experience you want to be below 70% before starting the repeat if not pull the plug. Maybe that's why you're stuck? There is a post in this thread from @Derek Toshner that outlines a number of key points. Sounds like you might want to back down the weight and get some 20 to 40 minute sessions in consistently? All the best bro!
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Ahh that’s significantly less than what was mentioned in the book. Still might be interesting to try it out. For now on the planning is to do a proper test in the near future and lower reps first. Also on Saturday I think I’ll experiment with a metal heart type of workout to boost the lacking cardio a bit.
 
I’m currently following IC c+p/j x3 + fsq x2 but thinking of adding the AXE snatch version to my routine. I prefer snatch over swing. Do you think it might be too much overhead work?

I’m on a month-long break from work, so I can intensify my workouts, planning two “minimalist” programs daily on separate days. However, I need to be mindful of balancing recovery.

Any insights would be appreciated. Thanks!
 
Grevlingfot said:
I’m currently following IC c+p/j x3 + fsq x2 but thinking of adding the AXE snatch version to my routine. I prefer snatch over swing. Do you think it might be too much overhead work?

I’m on a month-long break from work, so I can intensify my workouts, planning two “minimalist” programs daily on separate days. However, I need to be mindful of balancing recovery.

Any insights would be appreciated. Thanks!
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I typically do two IC sessions and two AXE sessions a week using the snatch and haven’t had any issues with overhead work. Personally, I find both IC and AXE relatively easy to recover from given neither protocol pushes the limits.
 
Managed to hit 40 sets at 4x EMOM with 24KG today with a maximum HR of 157 BPM and an average HR 139 BPM HR. I'm gonna bump it up to six EMOM for 10-20 sets on Thursday and then deload the next week.

I'm in a minor state of shock that I pulled this off a couple hours after our 6 AM MMA class (which was an 'all technique' class not a sparring class so I had the energy to both be throwing punches and takedowns and after a cup of coffee and a couple hours able to pull of the swings for AXE). It'll be interesting to see how I recover by tomorrow morning.
 
Aziatik said:
Today the opportunity for experiment presented it's self. I was resting or doing liss on Wed following SE Squats but I decided to try another AXE session after hitting one on Monday and feeling fully recovered from both.

Today after a good shoulder warm up I went 40kg AXE at the low rep count and took it to 24 minutes...i could feel my grip going and noticed a change in explosivity in the last 2 rounds. Heart rate was fine as was breathing. It was the muscles themselves that hit the stop sign. I rested a bit then grabbed a pair of 24s for 5 press on the 2' which I took to 8 rounds, 40 reps. Long session today all told at 68min.

I like the way today went and will alter my schedule to -
Mon axe/press
Tues SESquats/pull
Wed axe/press (option to rest)
Thurs SEheavy day/sled/pull (option to rest)
Fri Axe/press
Sat SESquats/pull
Sun Rest or LISS

I'm really liking this program! View attachment 23024
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Damn an hour of axe?
 
Derek Toshner said:
1) Climbing has a lot of pulling. It's hard to train a lot of pulling, then go climbing & expect to have a good climbing session. When rock/ice climbing is the goal, I usually focus on a balance in my training by putting a larger emphasis on pushing, and keeping pulling to a minimum (GTG/Easy Strength). When hiking/running/Obstacle course racing are the goals go ahead and pull often
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I'll second this. one of the (many) mistakes I and others in my cohort made back in the 80s and 90s was to over do pulling work-- rings, rope, pullups, etc. --while also doing as much climbing volume as possible. even truer, now that climbing gyms mean most of us spend even more time on steeps than we used to (aside from the folks who lived in the Gunks).

this past season i wanted to crank up my trail mileage and also have periodic climbing days w/o getting injured, so i cut back to 2 sessions a week of long cycle with a single bell. worked freakin great. 6 mos w/o an injury, radically improved my cardio after a bad bout of asthma, and now i'm back to heavier stuff 3 days a week.
 
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